Football Programmes Centre

Pete’s Picture Palace

Hi All

Once again I'm asking for some help please. This time it features a game at Torquay United in 1961/2 or thereabouts. The Torquay player far left in yellow & blue kit is Gordon Astall, the ex Birmingham player.

Now, he only played 33 games for the Gulls, having signed for them in July 1961. So that suggests it's 61/2, and Div 3 action though Torquay were relegated at the end of that season.

So my question is - who's in the all white kit? It's not Palace...…

All help as always, very gratefully received. Thank you all.

Sherlock

Grumpypants · Joined: 09 Feb 2012 Posts: 350

Not 100%, but I have a feeling it could be Torquay v Queens Park Rangers that was played on Boxing Day 1961. I remember seeing the Rangers play against Torquay in all white before, but don't go by my memory for definite. I don't recognise any players at all, bit before my days!!

Pete’s Picture Palace · Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:33 pm Post subject:

Thanks GP, that's an interesting shout.

Someone else has suggested it might be Newport or Hull who'd have had to change colours.

I'll put some feelers out.

Sherlock

Grumpypants · Joined: 09 Feb 2012 Posts: 350

Managed to find my 1961/62 Torquay home programmes. Going through them, the programme states that Newport County were due to play in Black and White kit and that Hull City were due to play in all Red. The only entry for an all White kit was against Watford played on 2 September 1961, which makes sense as Watford play in very similar colours. Hope that this helps.

Rocky · Joined: 15 Jun 2009 Posts: 1445

Grumpypants wrote:

Managed to find my 1961/62 Torquay home programmes. Going through them, the programme states that Newport County were due to play in Black and White kit and that Hull City were due to play in all Red. The only entry for an all White kit was against Watford played on 2 September 1961, which makes sense as Watford play in very similar colours. Hope that this helps.

A good deduction and one that could indicate that it is indeed Watford. However looking at the trees behind the stand, one has shed it's leaves whilst the other could be an evergreen. Taking that into account and noting the ground conditions, it could possibly be later in the year than September. Torquay played Harwich & Parkeston in the FA Cup during November and according to wiki, their away kit is shown as all white. Their normal kit is striped, but a possibility? Do you have the programme v Harwich & Parkeston GP?

Of course, as has been suggested, it could be QPR on Boxing Day.
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Pete’s Picture Palace · Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:42 am Post subject:

Thanks again GP and Rocky.

Some comments on this - I've been contacted on Twitter by a historian who helps me a lot with ID's.

He tells me that Gordon Astall didn't play against Harwich & Parkeston in the FA Cup. He also says that for QPR Roy Bentley played at No 2 and there's no way Roy Bentley is No 2 in that photo.

So that rules out H&P and QPR.

He thinks it could well be Hull whom they played on 20th Jan 1962, the weather looks like January, and the trees, and the spectators too in their overcoats. Les Green was the Hull keeper, Andy Davidson the No 2, and probably Brian Bulless jumping. Astall played and scored.

But that's if Hull weren't wearing all red, as the programme suggests.

And the weather, trees, clothing etc surely rules out Watford on 2nd September, doesn't it? Even though white kit may be right.

I'll contact a Hull man and a Watford man now.

Thanks again Sherlock

daiward · Joined: 05 May 2016 Posts: 86 Location: Devon

Might well be Watford. Goalkeeper could be Dave Underwood and right back Bobby Bell. Challenging for the ball could be Ken Nicholas and on the far left in the distance Freddie Bunce.[/img]

Pete’s Picture Palace · Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:00 am Post subject:

Thanks Dai, my feelers are out now.

Cheers all!
Pete

Sherlock

daiward · Joined: 05 May 2016 Posts: 86 Location: Devon

Apologies for quality of the pic. That's Dave Underwood & Bobby Bell in foreground in match against Southend later that season. Bunce is in the same position as the Torquay pic in the far distance.

daiward · Joined: 05 May 2016 Posts: 86 Location: Devon

Pete’s Picture Palace · Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:39 am Post subject:

Looks good, Dai.

Thumbs Up

Pete’s Picture Palace · Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 5:24 pm Post subject:

My Hull City contact confirms it's them.

20th Jan 1962, Les Green was the Hull keeper in one of only 4 games for the Tigers, Andy Davidson the No 2, and Brian Bulless jumping. Result 4-2 to Torquay, Astall scored one of them.

Thanks everyone!

Sherlock

galmpton · Joined: 24 Apr 2012 Posts: 83

Gordon Astell still lives in Torquay and still going strong at 91

daiward · Joined: 05 May 2016 Posts: 86 Location: Devon

Happy with result. The 'Keeper was the main worry as it didn't look like Dave Underwood. But the rest were closer.

Pete’s Picture Palace · Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:21 pm Post subject:

galmpton wrote:

Gordon Astell still lives in Torquay and still going strong at 91

Thank you, that's nice to know.

tufcprogs · Joined: 08 Oct 2013 Posts: 290

What a great forum this is.