Dealers Prices of Football Programmes

[Scholey]

I have noticed that the prices quoted by most dealers for programmes can vary quite a bit. When attempting to ascertain the true value of a programme, which dealers prices are the most accurate and realistic to use as a yardstick. I tend to compare the prices on Footballprogrammes.com, Sports Programmes, Dick Rattray Football Programmes and Steve Earl's website.

Many Thanks

[kcs]

It's a very tricky question, the dealers you have mentioned have been around for a while so it could suggest that their prices are competive.

However, for me, most but not all dealers are quite expensive but provide a very good service & know their customer base.... Hence still trading.

I would use eBay as a guide too, that's the current price someone is willing to pay.... I use Michael Hewitt as a guide for my own purchases and bid accordingly.

As a wiseman once said.... Shop around
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[Kickoff3pm]

I am a dealer and funny enough i have the same problem

What I did in the start was look at all the sites I could find but soon realised that condition and the reported condition makes a world of difference. And some people just don't know, that the reason for offers lists. Others are chancers and will list everything at an high price.

What I would say if look for the best possible condition, use that as a sounding board. If something is cheaper look at the condition and ask why?

You should also condition what if something goes wrong, not always anyone's fault but you need these problems sorted out the right way and you don't want to go chasing people. So the quality of service should be included.

Be very suspect about ebay, images are not always what they seem to be and sellers often don't understand condition at all.

[Fishy]

I agree with kcs and kickoff - Ebay can be a tricky place. I am not a dealer and have come across all sorts of variations of quality - not always correctly described.

Also, in an open auction situation you anly need 2 people to really want the item in question and the price can be skewed upwards to well above the normal price.

I collect Millwall programmes and when I can I keep a record of prices that items sell for (only the rarer stuff now). This gives me a rough guide but a guide only.

I have purchased from a number of dealers, including those mentioned above, and have never had a problem.

The golden rule - if in any doubt - ask questions! If you don't get a satisfactory answer stay well clear.

Happy hunting
ian

[Kickoff3pm]

Good points, A good idea of what you are dealing with is to just send an email.

Some dealers take days to respond others don't even bother. A dealer who want to help will always respond within a day or so and will be honest - well as honest as they can be within giving thier information away.

As for ebay - just had a few items finish after 4 years of not using it. Still suprised as items that were avilable here for 1-5 quid in my offers still went ofr 99p to £85 !

As for the people on ebay ? well they seem to be only two types - plain crazy mad who moan about the condition of their 99p bargains and very nice / sensible.

[goonerboy]

trouble is that eBay is an auction and thus price is bidder dependent and date dependent rather than item value. If 2 people really want it and and have the disposable income then ridiculous prices can be reached. On the other hand you can put an old/rare item on and start the auction at 99p and if only one person needs it/spots it etc then it can go for 99p. Its often said that the value is what people will pay but even that is flawed. For example there was your everton v chelsea ticket that reached the mid £80. If you had 3 of them then the two people who engaged in the bidding war might be willing to pay £80 to secure it but you then put the 3rd one on ebay and would probably find it makes a £5. So what is true value ?

In our hobby there are no absolutes but price range guides and ultimately just pay what you are comfortable paying and what you can afford.....and just be patient because everything comes up again..and again

[ToffeeDan]

Everton v Chelsea - what year?

[Kickoff3pm]

goonerboy wrote:

For example there was your everton v chelsea ticket that reached the mid £80. If you had 3 of them then the two people who engaged in the bidding war might be willing to pay £80 to secure it but you then put the 3rd one on ebay and would probably find it makes a £5. So what is true value ?

I've had so many emails asking why that reached £85 I only wish I knew but then I've not had payment yet so won't say too much

I would really like the collectors market to get back to buying from the heart and not the pocket. Do we really get more enjoyment from sell-on values then we do owning a bit of history ? everyone one a bargain today.

[Kickoff3pm]

ToffeeDan wrote:

Everton v Chelsea - what year?

1970 do you want a photo copy before I post it, that has got to be worth a fiver

[Footyfan]

I do a bit of "wheelin & dealin" to fund my own collection of Leeds united and Bradford PA memorabilia.

As a collector myself as a general rule for my surplus items I set my prices on what I believe I would pay, I always describe items accurately knowing how important condition is. I like many other have been down the *buy it cheap" route only to replace with quality items at a later date so the "but it cheap" option is often false economy.

Some 'professional dealers' are way OTT with prices whereas others are more realistic. It is definitely a buyers market and there is a lot of competition out there.

The key to collecting is knowing your subject, knowing the rare items viz-a-viz the run of the mill but at the end of the day everyone has a budget so stick to it.

Ebay has been a godsend and I have picked many of my wants over the years but it is notorious for items selling for high prices as bidders get carried away only for the same item to appear again a couple of days later as other sellers try to cash in. In the collecting hobby patience really is a virtue.

However, I do believe some collectors are too"perfectionist" wanting "mint" condition programmes for 1950s early 1960s items. Programme collecting really took off in the UK after the 1966 World Cup when there was a massive surge in interest in all aspects of football. The majority of dealers state that team changes etc are acceptable in pre 1966 items, this is because these items really are harder to find.

Then of course you have the "want it for nothing" brigade. I have responded to many on this forum seeking programmes only to find they want you to give the stuff away so I rarely bother these days.

[goonerboy]

Fully agree mate. Including the last point. Some people on this forum just expect something for nothing just because they are on the forum. They seem to ignore the fact that others did not get the programme for free and nor are we a charity. I often buy job lots in order to get something that I need and then pass on the remainder at a fair price and often use the guide price on the Market Place on this forum which is among the cheapest around. Sadly even that is not good enough for some folks. Thus I have come to the same conclusion as you, why live with the grief so I limit my dealings to folks on here that I know are decent, fair and respectful of other collectors and when you offer them a programme at a fair price then appreciate it instead of take the mick and try to screw an extra few pence out of you.

Anyway I suspect prices will be a long running debate in this hobby because there are no absolutes.

[Auchinleckian]

Interesting debate, and one that will always rumble. Before the advent of ebay, there was a certain logic to programme prices and most folk knew that if a programme was on sale at a price with one dealer, then that would roughly be the price with the majority of others - bar the one or two who live in a parallel universe where they think just by doubling the price of an item makes it "rare"

Ebay has made everybody a dealer of some sorts. It's a strange thing, but the vast majority of folk who want to buy things for pennies very rarely wish to sell them at the same price! People who moan about dealers prices also forget that for the majority of them, they have to pay tax which means that 20% of all prices has to be accounted for in their tax returns. Some have office facilities to pay for, which also have to be heated. It all adds up when coming to pricing items. The chancers who sell occasionally on ebay, and moan about dealer's prices will not disclose their sales to HMRC, I assume!

[ToffeeDan]

Kickoff3pm wrote:

ToffeeDan wrote: Everton v Chelsea - what year? 1970 do you want a photo copy before I post it, that has got to be worth a fiver

That was really nice of you - sorry I missed that. I'm not big on tickets tho' but was curious why it was so much! Perhaps it was the Charity Shield game.

All the best

[Tynie Topics]

Auchinleckian wrote:

Interesting debate, and one that will always rumble. Before the advent of ebay, there was a certain logic to programme prices and most folk knew that if a programme was on sale at a price with one dealer, then that would roughly be the price with the majority of others - bar the one or two who live in a parallel universe where they think just by doubling the price of an item makes it "rare" Ebay has made everybody a dealer of some sorts. It's a strange thing, but the vast majority of folk who want to buy things for pennies very rarely wish to sell them at the same price! People who moan about dealers prices also forget that for the majority of them, they have to pay tax which means that 20% of all prices has to be accounted for in their tax returns. Some have office facilities to pay for, which also have to be heated. It all adds up when coming to pricing items. The chancers who sell occasionally on ebay, and moan about dealer's prices will not disclose their sales to HMRC, I assume!

On the whole, I find a lot of dealers prices to be out of touch with reality. There are some who have their finger on the pulse and adjust prices accordingly, but for many you look at their catalogues/websites and frankly have a wee giggle at the asking prices.

However, you cant just compare prices directly to ebay, as others have said a lot of the sellers are private individuals with little or no overheads to account for so can sell cheaper.

I guess the answer is as ever, shop around and give it time. Just because you can only see one dealer currently stocking a particular programme at £50 one month, it doesn't mean to say another dealer wont have it in stock a few months later for half that.
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