everybody was happy!!

[tbfacsm]

A story from a recent auction that made me happy.

Yesterday i attended Capes Dunn new auction room in Stockport.
They mostly do "other" collectables but usually have a small football section.
As they have limited knowledge due to not specialising in football the lots do need careful inspection.
Having fairly recently acquired a pre first world war scrap book from the Manchester United goalkeeper of that era and with it being just round the corner i attended yesterday
There was only one lot of interest to me which was described as 52 Manchester United related press photos from the late 1940's with many bearing autographs-Estimate £100-150(**as i say little knowledge**)
Having viewed i discovered that these were good sized,top quality press photos with stamps on the back.
Mostly action photos with the relative subject having neatly signed.
The bad news was that many had damages of varying degree to the edges.
My opinion was that these were £40 ish photos with an autograph worth say £10 so maybe £50 if they had been in good condition.
With the damages i came back to high £30's(maybe £40 tops each) so £1500/2000.
Well the auction starts at £70 and climbs quickly with me and an internet bidder(who was jumping up in £100 bids) to £1000.
At this point(ish) the internet bidder drops out and i was left with a room bidder who eventually beat me off at £1900 plus commission.

At this point(the point of this story) i was approached by 3 people of which 2 were ladies and both crying.
The photos had belonged to their mother who had passed a couple of months ago.
She had owned a newsagent in her working days and these were shoved in a cupboard and presumed valueless due to the condition.
It was only when clearing the house that Capes Dunn were invited to value and sell,along with some other small items.
They were hoping for a few hundred in total to buy something to remember their mother by.
With the other bits they now had over £2000.They both had lockets with their mothers ashes round their necks
So the auctioneer was happy with his commission,they were happy with the sale,the buyer was happy with his purchases and i,on reflection was happy enough at what i didn't get them for.

I wonder what would have happened if they had stumbled on to a forum,any forum,with their story
I suspect they would have been "pm sent" to death and would now be the proud owners of £150/200.
Then again i may be wrong

[Five and In]

tbfacsm wrote:

A story from a recent auction that made me happy. Yesterday i attended Capes Dunn new auction room in Stockport. They mostly do "other" collectables but usually have a small football section. As they have limited knowledge due to not specialising in football the lots do need careful inspection. Having fairly recently acquired a pre first world war scrap book from the Manchester United goalkeeper of that era and with it being just round the corner i attended yesterday There was only one lot of interest to me which was described as 52 Manchester United related press photos from the late 1940's with many bearing autographs-Estimate £100-150(**as i say little knowledge**) Having viewed i discovered that these were good sized,top quality press photos with stamps on the back. Mostly action photos with the relative subject having neatly signed. The bad news was that many had damages of varying degree to the edges. My opinion was that these were £40 ish photos with an autograph worth say £10 so maybe £50 if they had been in good condition. With the damages i came back to high £30's(maybe £40 tops each) so £1500/2000. Well the auction starts at £70 and climbs quickly with me and an internet bidder(who was jumping up in £100 bids) to £1000. At this point(ish) the internet bidder drops out and i was left with a room bidder who eventually beat me off at £1900 plus commission. At this point(the point of this story) i was approached by 3 people of which 2 were ladies and both crying. The photos had belonged to their mother who had passed a couple of months ago. She had owned a newsagent in her working days and these were shoved in a cupboard and presumed valueless due to the condition. It was only when clearing the house that Capes Dunn were invited to value and sell,along with some other small items. They were hoping for a few hundred in total to buy something to remember their mother by. With the other bits they now had over £2000.They both had lockets with their mothers ashes round their necks So the auctioneer was happy with his commission,they were happy with the sale,the buyer was happy with his purchases and i,on reflection was happy enough at what i didn't get them for. I wonder what would have happened if they had stumbled on to a forum,any forum,with their story I suspect they would have been "pm sent" to death and would now be the proud owners of £150/200. Then again i may be wrong

What a great story and result for the ladies

[wandererpaul]

A nice story and happy for them. Good to read.

You then ruin the post with a usual snipe at the forum and its members. Well done you.

Whatever your opinions are of this forum and its members, it's a shame you come back in here, under a new name because you were banned before, with your previous impersonal jibes.

Stunned really, but not surprised. Some people just cannot help themselves.

You have the knowledge and the stories to tell too. Shame.
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[Tynie Topics]

Nice story.

I think most of us can hazard a guess as to where it originated from given the snide end comment, a banned former member perhaps?

Imagine what would have happened if there were no other bidders and he got them for £70, what a result..........
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[tbfacsm]

i am not going to be drawn into a personal battle(again)

It was not a snipe at anybody but a question about the overall integrity of collectors in general.
If you had read the post i say
"i wonder what would have happened if they had stumbled on to A FORUM,ANY FORUM with their story"
I don't suggest that any member of this forum would have acted incorrectly do i?
I have not even mentioned THIS forum.
You have unfortunately twisted my words

I was banned previously because certain people,in my opinion, had an agenda and wound me up.
I have admitted that i have now listened,and agreed with those reasons.
I came back because i seriously want to help the hobby progress
I have been back a fair while,as you can easily see and i believe i have done nothing but help.
I have only come out of the closet as i was named yesterday and there was no realistic further reason to hide
If the forum wishes to ban me again,i cannot stop it but do you seriously believe that the hobby would be better off without me on this forum.
If that is indeed the case then you have only one option left open to you and i would this time go on my merry way.
If you believe differently then leave me in peace.

I gave you a heart warming story about how good the hobby can be.
Add that to the programme that i sent to the late Tommy Cavanaghs daughter and what harm have i done.Please note i just sent a programme and no letter or note asking if she had anything to sell etc.
She didn't deserve that sort of harassment and if she did ever have anything to sell i would hope she would come back to a "friendly" forum and ask for and receive,fair advice

[Tynie Topics]

tbfacsm wrote:

If the forum wishes to ban me again,i cannot stop it but do you seriously believe that the hobby would be better off without me on this forum.

Wow, I think I tripped over your ego there...........
_________________
https://www.flickr.com/photos/footballprogrammes/albums

[tbfacsm]

Tynie Topics wrote:

Nice story. I think most of us can hazard a guess as to where it originated from given the snide end comment, a banned former member perhaps? Imagine what would have happened if there were no other bidders and he got them for £70, what a result..........

i have openly admitted who i am.
There is no secret

"Imagine what would have happened if there were no other bidders"
Well the salesroom.com makes it almost impossible for anything to slip through any net.
Any dealer with an ounce of work ethic monitors every auction alongside collectors nowadays
The whole hobby has changed in the last 20 years
In my early days,pre auction houses,dealers went out and looked for items and knowing their business and their targets they would sell to collectors
Now with auction houses and computers the whole concept has changed dramatically with dealers and collectors monitoring the exact same areas.
So the chances of getting a £1500 item for £70 is almost non existent.
As such the "what a result" scenario is almost impossible to find in an open sale.
However the "what a result" scenario is significantly likely to happen on a forum and in my opinion just not right.
Anybody else is however,quite correctly, entitled to a different opinion.
But should an honest and polite differing of opinion, demand to be backed up by a ban?

[tbfacsm]

Tynie Topics wrote:

tbfacsm wrote: If the forum wishes to ban me again,i cannot stop it but do you seriously believe that the hobby would be better off without me on this forum. Wow, I think I tripped over your ego there...........

You really do have a desire to try to wind me up into saying something out of order.
Is there a specific reason?

[Tynie Topics]

tbfacsm wrote:

Tynie Topics wrote: tbfacsm wrote: If the forum wishes to ban me again,i cannot stop it but do you seriously believe that the hobby would be better off without me on this forum. Wow, I think I tripped over your ego there........... You really do have a desire to try to wind me up into saying something out of order. Is there a specific reason?

I'm not winding you up.

Perhaps if you actually showed a modicum of respect towards this forum and the members who use it, then they would tolerate your presence. However, from the above posts it appears you haven't learned any lessons, and you snuck back under another ID.

The forum has ran pretty well these last 6 months, people helping each other out without a hint of judgemental responses. I for one would like that to continue, but then it's not upto me.
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https://www.flickr.com/photos/footballprogrammes/albums

[PompeyPhil]

My post from the Duncans Edwards thread.......

For what it's worth.....your response to the Portsmouth v Utd 46-47 thread was much appreciated by this poster/user. I won,t dwell on past "issues" but would just reliterate that this is a cracking forum with great knowledgable members (like yourself) who can contribute positively to this fantastic hobby no matter which team they support, what they collect or how big or small individual budgets are!! Remember that and I can't foresee any "issues"......welcome back.

Didn't last long did it?

[tbfacsm]

well i have read back through my posts and i cannot see where i have showed a modicum of disrespect to anybody.

The only insult was you to me when you accused me,without any evidence of tripping up over my ego

For information to other forum members i can already unfortunately see the bullies gathering yet again and i fear that a ban may be coming.
I hope not and i am now closing my comments on this thread as a nice story has turned nasty through no fault of my own.
I do hope that a ban does not come as i enjoy the forum but that is not my choice

If a ban does come and any forum member needs any help or opinion on anything Manchester United then feel free to contact me at [email protected].
I will try to oblige

[Tynie Topics]

tbfacsm wrote:

well i have read back through my posts and i cannot see where i have showed a modicum of disrespect to anybody. The only insult was you to me when you accused me,without any evidence of tripping up over my ego For information to other forum members i can already unfortunately see the bullies gathering yet again and i fear that a ban may be coming. I hope not and i am now closing my comments on this thread as a nice story has turned nasty through no fault of my own. I do hope that a ban does not come as i enjoy the forum but that is not my choice If a ban does come and any forum member needs any help or opinion on anything Manchester United then feel free to contact me at [email protected]. I will try to oblige

Self awareness is clearly lacking if you don't notice your egotistical postings, and here is your disrespect;

"I wonder what would have happened if they had stumbled on to a forum,any forum,with their story. I suspect they would have been "pm sent" to death and would now be the proud owners of £150/200. "

Sneaking back under an assumed ID is not showing much respect to the people who run the forum either.
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https://www.flickr.com/photos/footballprogrammes/albums

[seand]

Hi Ray

like many on here I'm often delighted to see your detailed, helpful contributions and links to some of your fantastic collection. But like many on here I got tired of your attitude.

tbfacsm wrote:

I wonder what would have happened if they had stumbled on to a forum,any forum,with their story I suspect they would have been "pm sent" to death and would now be the proud owners of £150/200.

Can you really not see the issue some people would have with the quote above? You may say 'a forum, any forum' but the fact that we're talking about football memorabilia and the fact that you're posting on this forum certainly suggests you're talking about this forum, and your track record on the 'PM sent' issue suggests you have a problem with this forum. For the record I reckon if they'd posted here they'd get at least a couple of messages telling them a realistic value, and to take them to auction.

tbfacsm wrote:

do you seriously believe that the hobby would be better off without me on this forum.

With all your snideness it got to the stage where the majority on here thought YES, yes we are better off without one of the most knowledgeable and often one of the most helpful collectors out there.

So please stick around but try not to be a knob. It's nice to have the insight of the man with the second best collection of the second best team in Manchester!

[RoddyN]

I for one with my limited knowledge of the subject really appreciate TBFACSM's (whatever that stands for) vast experience and assistance.

[tbfacsm]

Hi seand

I take on board everything you say and agree with most.
as i said on another post my role is not to challenge others or allow myself to be wound up by others
There is no point.

I can see why some people might have an issue with my quote about being pm'd and now the proud owner of £150/200 but i was talking about forums in general.This forum therefore would come under that umbrella but i did not just have this forum in mind.
I really believe that this goes on far too much on forums for me to be comfortable as a collector.
I agree there would have been a few genuine suggestions but equally you would be naieve if you think that nobody would try and nip in and nick it for no other reason than they would try to convince the owner that they were the oracle on all things related to that sub.
I have no issue with things being cheaper.Especially at say a programme fair where something had slipped through or a second hand bookshop where a specific price is being asked.
But when somebody comes on for help and gets nipped it goes against my personal grain.Believe me it has happened on here and will again.
That is what i will campaign against and if it doesn't happen then i will have nothing to campaign against.
I hope you might agree with that

The snideness point i agree with.
It is my personal defence mechanism,i am afraid and when i get continually attacked by a few bullies that was my of responding.
As i say i won't go down that road.

Second best collection of the second best team!!!
The way United are shaping at the moment i would consider second best team an honour.I think they are worse than that and with the current owners i think it will get a lot worse.But that's another story.
Second best collection.Again i think less than that but i have no delusions of grandeur.
I am happy to just keeping on adding where possible to my collection and making it available on flickr to anybody that wants to use it for anything.
That's the way i will continue to work

Enjoy(i hope)

[kcs]

Hi Ray,

I am glad that your back.

Look forward to your knowledge being shared once more. Always nice to welcome a knowledgable member to the forum that bends over backwards to help others out.




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[hydemaine]

RoddyN wrote:

I for one with my limited knowledge of the subject really appreciate TBFACSM's (whatever that stands for) vast experience and assistance.

10p Fish and French fries establishment vendor ?

[Rocky]

kcs wrote:

I am glad that your back. Look forward to your knowledge being shared once more. Always nice to welcome a knowledgable member to the forum that bends over backwards to help others out.

I’m also pleased to see you back on the forum Ray to provide your knowledge and experience. Hopefully we'll see more of the 'reformed character' you mentioned in another thread rather than the previous, at times, 'disconcerting character'.

Meanwhile I'm going to ask for a valuation for some 1990 Middlesbrough programmes to see if somebody else has reappeared under a different guise.

[Tynie Topics]

tbfacsm wrote:

Hi seand I take on board everything you say and agree with most. as i said on another post my role is not to challenge others or allow myself to be wound up by others There is no point. I can see why some people might have an issue with my quote about being pm'd and now the proud owner of £150/200 but i was talking about forums in general.This forum therefore would come under that umbrella but i did not just have this forum in mind. I really believe that this goes on far too much on forums for me to be comfortable as a collector. I agree there would have been a few genuine suggestions but equally you would be naieve if you think that nobody would try and nip in and nick it for no other reason than they would try to convince the owner that they were the oracle on all things related to that sub. I have no issue with things being cheaper.Especially at say a programme fair where something had slipped through or a second hand bookshop where a specific price is being asked. But when somebody comes on for help and gets nipped it goes against my personal grain.Believe me it has happened on here and will again. That is what i will campaign against and if it doesn't happen then i will have nothing to campaign against. I hope you might agree with that The snideness point i agree with. It is my personal defence mechanism,i am afraid and when i get continually attacked by a few bullies that was my of responding. As i say i won't go down that road. Second best collection of the second best team!!! The way United are shaping at the moment i would consider second best team an honour.I think they are worse than that and with the current owners i think it will get a lot worse.But that's another story. Second best collection.Again i think less than that but i have no delusions of grandeur. I am happy to just keeping on adding where possible to my collection and making it available on flickr to anybody that wants to use it for anything. That's the way i will continue to work Enjoy(i hope)

Who exactly is bullying you?

You are a banned member of this forum and for good reason, you have snuck back in under a different ID, presumably without the knowledge of the people who run the forum (where the respect for Past Pirate and Craig?), and now you’re playing the victim card when members call you out for who you are.

As has been pointed out by a few, your attitude towards this forum and its members is questionable at best and in my opinion hasn’t changed one iota, scratch a little and the same disdain is there for everyone to see. You are playing the “Policeman” card as you did before to justify yourself, painting the picture that you’re just here to protect the innocents, that in itself is disrespectful to all members by suggesting that we’re all out to take advantage of unknowledgeable newbies “That is what I will campaign against and if it doesn't happen then i will have nothing to campaign against.” Personally, I don’t see the need for the forum to have someone campaigning against anything, and certainly not by you.

I’ll leave it there, but if your presence is tolerated then I’ll bow out of the forum, it’s not worth it.
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[hydemaine]

Thanks for all the advice and help you have given me over
The years Ray.