Ebay v Dealers (Another Thread)

[JJPROGRAMMES]

Was browsing Ebay looking to fill some gaps in the collection (70`s & 80`s progs) via the Buy-it-nows and was also checking for some match tickets (Cup Finals etc),

Found that every 70`s & 80`s programme I wanted was "well" overpriced some were listed at between £2.99 & £3.99 with free postage (wow!!), these programmes are worth no more than a £1 + postage and can be found in dealers catalogues (& most web-sites) for that price!

As for the tickets half of them are Repo`s or Copy`s (some "though" are museum quality!!!) and again the but-it-now prices are well off the mark, never seen a Dealer sell a repo ticket or charge stupid prices for one.

Is it time to support our "Tax paying Dealers" opposed to the "Non-Tax payers of Ebay"????

[Ruud Van Driver]

JJPROGRAMMES wrote:

Was browsing Ebay looking to fill some gaps in the collection (70`s & 80`s progs) via the Buy-it-nows, Found that every 70`s & 80`s programme I wanted was "well" overpriced some were listed at between £2.99 & £3.99 with free postage (wow!!) Is it time to support our "Tax paying Dealers" opposed to the "Non-Tax payers of Ebay"????

Were the programmes priced beteween £2.99 and £3.99 (with free p+p) not being sold by a business seller who would presumably be paying tax?

It's not me by the way!
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[JJPROGRAMMES]

JJPROGRAMMES wrote:

Is it time to support our "Tax paying Dealers" opposed to the "Non-Tax payers of Ebay"????

What I meant was Ebay has hardly paid any tax in the UK over the last couple of years, not the seller (or sellers) who have put "up" their prices to have the prevliage to sell on (not tax paying) ebay.

[Tynie Topics]

Does a private individual who chooses to sell a "second hand" item via ebay liable for tax? I think not.

As for who to support, I support whoever offers me the best deal for a programme I want!
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[goonerboy]

re the tax question I am not sure it is relevant whether it is second hand or not. The general rule is that if someone buys an item with the purpose of selling at a profit then they should pay tax on it.

What perhaps is the grey area is defining "purpose" eg you buy a job lot at an auction in order to sell as individual items then it seems pretty much to fall into the "tax due" category. But what if you buy a job lot which has an item of interest for your collection but as you have no interest in the other items you sell them ? Maybe as your purpose was your item rather than buy to sell then it is not taxable ?

Also how long does someone have to hold an item before it is not considered have been bought for profit reasons ? At some stage does it move from income tax to capital gains ?

[Ruud Van Driver]

Bit of a grey area for me this tax question. There is a seller on eBay who sells for £2.99/£3.99 with freepost and has over 40,000 items listed, they are a business seller and therefore pay tax, they no doubt buy to sell and are doing nothing whatsoever wrong.

I however have never bought with the intention of selling but should I ever decide to sell-up I could get fairly near their total items listed but should I therefore pay tax on it? Would love to know the definitive answer from an expert although I suspect tax would be due as it would be impossible to prove that I legitimately bought with no intention to sell?

Anyone on here who knows the answer to this rather than just assumption?
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[Tynie Topics]

goonerboy wrote:

re the tax question I am not sure it is relevant whether it is second hand or not. The general rule is that if someone buys an item with the purpose of selling at a profit then they should pay tax on it.

Fair point, I was thinking more along the lines of VAT on the actual item [which would already have been paid, if liable] and not Income Tax.
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[Fishy]

Totally agree with Tynie re: the best deal. Surely this has always been the way though. The main difference now is that Ebay and Online Auctions have changed the dynamics a lot.

Regarding tax: I am a collector and not a dealer. I sometimes, though rarely, will purchase a bulk lot to get the odd programme. I will then sell on Ebay the few items I have spare - sometimes at a loss and rarely at a 'profit'.
My take on would be: everyone has a personal allowance for Income Tax and for capital Gains Tax. Therefore, as far as I am aware, in this day and age most people are supposed to fill in a Self Assessment Form annually. The amount of IT payable by people like me would be very little if not nil (that's not to say that there will be some who should be paying). The costs for me would certainly wipe out any gains via income and I would probably be owed some Tax

As far as Capital Gains goes: I think that this would only come in to play if a collector (bearing in mind that Dealers can be collecctors as well) sells their collection (or vast portion of it). Everyone has then an Annual Allowance to set against this which can be used retrospectively (to a point). Any gains can also be set against a sliding scale over some past years. you should then be able to prove what you paid, when, and how much it was sold for - I suggest that this would be a nightmare for mast of us who probably haven't made detailed records! I would also suggest that this part is seldom an issue as it will be a fairly rare occurence and the Inland revenue have got a lot of bigger people to catch!

There will be a wealth of info on the Inland Revenue website - working out what actually applies to you may be a minefield though!
If you have a local Tax Office you will often find them very helpful if you want to look into this matter further - you don't have to give them much info - just ask generic / hypothetic questions.

I now have sore fingers due to my one finger typing skills so will leave it there!

[Eck]

I buy bulk items because I get them cheaper. I have over 150 duplicate Rangers programmes. I have never sold a programme but I have quite a stock of various programmes. I won't sell until I explore my selling options which is likely to be to sell locally rather than share profits with the Royal mail. I have to think about the ethical side but if it's just dribs and drabs then it's still part of the hobby of collecting, selling to boost funds for your own collection.

[Wullie]

Eck wrote:

I buy bulk items because I get them cheaper. I have over 150 duplicate Rangers programmes. I have never sold a programme but I have quite a stock of various programmes. I won't sell until I explore my selling options which is likely to be to sell locally rather than share profits with the Royal mail. I have to think about the ethical side but if it's just dribs and drabs then it's still part of the hobby of collecting, selling to boost funds for your own collection.

Come on, share your ptofits with Royal Mail, i don't mind What people will never understand, at the end of the day, if you buy something from some distance, then unless you are going to collect it yourself, or someone is going to drive 100s of miles to deliver a 99p item, then you are going to have to use a delivery company, Royal Mail or private it doesn't matter. A private company will have share holders and they will want a profit. Prices will always go up ( look at your gas bill). If you want gas, moan about it and pay up. If you want a delivery service have a moan then pay up. It's life, get on with it.

[Eck]

That is true Wullie but if you can find a way to maximise your profit margin ,you have to look at your expenditure and cut it down. Big businesses as you know, just raise the price of their product. Programme buyers as you know,are a shrewd lot and won't wear that at all.

I don't really have the desire to become a seller anyway but I may change my mind in the future. I'm going to buy a few hundred programmes soon all Scottish from the 60s & 70s and mostly Rangers we're in the process of arranging a meeting. I just love the sense of history from these items when i'm looking through them, even if it's not my team. I don't really want to sell any of my stock. I do have well over 100 Rangers duplicates though.

[Eck]

Tynie Topics wrote:

Does a private individual who chooses to sell a "second hand" item via ebay liable for tax? I think not. As for who to support, I support whoever offers me the best deal for a programme I want!

Makes perfect sense.