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The Forum’s Old & New in 2020. Quite a long read.
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The Forum’s Old & New in 2020. Quite a long read.
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pastpirate
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Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 2382
Location: The blue half of Bristol

PostPosted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 4:38 pm 
Post subject: The Forum’s Old & New in 2020. Quite a long read.
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The Forum’s Old & New in 2020.

What is the meaning of the word “Forum?, Well as we all know it is a meeting or a medium where ideas and views on a particular subjects can be expressed and exchanged & when in our modern day technological world via the internet it allows anyone & everyone to be able to interact with one another via posts and replies. Quite naturally, there will be times when subjects are raised and not everyone can or will agree to a single point of view, but in the main good discussion and repartee is the order of the day, everyone is entitled to their opinion provided of course that matters do not sink down to generating personal insults or the berating of others publicly as this cannot ever be accepted and goes against not only a democratic view but descending into abusive behaviour against any individuals because they share a different view under any circumstances will NEVER be tolerated.

With the latter comments from above, the Football Programme Centre has always tried to adhere to these simple “rules and regs”, the Forum has lasted for many years and when there has been any issues from individual’s as to the way that they are acting if badly, then words have been spoken over the years and if the same members persisted in creating issues that many other members felt were not correct, then the offenders would have had their offensive posts removed and if this bad attitude continued then they would be banned-unfortunately over the years there were 2 occasions where members were basically kicked out, one coming back in a couple of other new names until they were caught out and removed again and to this date have never returned.
Then there has been Raymond Adler who despite regaling everything that is wrong with the Forum and that he had no interest in it or that it is full of “2 bob fish n chip shop merchants”, collectors who have to ask permission of their wives to spend a fiver, non-collecting collectors and a whole host of other inane nasty remarks over the years and who was asked to wind his neck on an a number of occasions-ended up getting banned from the site then kept crawling back for a further 5 times until he eventually broke into one of his usual diatribes and was banned again for a record 6 times. Yes it is fair that a good proportion of chatter on Forums can be mundane with some subjects that are “snooze” types to say the more advanced collector, but there is absolutely no need to belittle folks because their level may just be a few notches below others!.

Recently, the new member BlueJames account sat dormant his usual sleeping role but slowly posts were made, nothing controversial at first just easing himself back into everything under the new pseudonym, but leopards never change their spots and soon one or two aggressive comments here or there started to make some of the older members take a closer look and it is at a time when the Forum is having many IT issues where members just simply cannot log in and it was becoming a nightmare, Craig who originally set up this tailor made website was no longer an active part-had not been for years and it was proving difficult in locating him and seeing if he could iron out matters as even myself as an Administrator, I was not able to access certain problems and in particular when in the past certain members needed to be removed I was unable to do so once their cover had been blown.
So during December the renaissance of BlueJames could see that he was untouchable and so he went on a mission of over a 100 posts in no time at all, the majority of these were about collecting and showing ff some of his prized possessions-excellent stuff-others would comment how knowledgeable he is and that all is well with the world, well it would be but the nasty snide comments were starting to re surface, the Sheffield Fair in December was commented on by his by him saying” If you turned upside down all the collectors who attended you would not find £500 fall out of their pockets” a typical “Adlerism” to go along with his previous regular favourites, then we had the Willy Waving and one or two members commented but not to his liking and they were met “Who are you, I would love to see the depth of your collection” and when others would challenge his mode de employ and ask why someone who can be such a good attribute to the Forum as against being as one regular member wrote just him being a Twat, he simply responds by either being sarcastic to them or shuts up as despite his wild and insane claims of “I am being bullied” HE is the chief protagonist and it seems despite his knowledge and good collection he cannot stop showing his jealous nature and continual sniping so now he has joined the Magnificent 7 and is no more, but no doubt we shall see another re-appearance in the future on both Forums but now that Craig has restored matters technologically there will be no delays in getting rid ever again from this one.
Yes, he will have his supporters but the weight of critics outweighs that as another reason why a number of members have joined the New Forum and are now on both.
Both Craig and I will not accept anything or any individual that disrupts the flow of how the Forum was intended to function
This leads me onto another more important subject of the New Forum.
Two years ago, when the original Forum was having issues with the same individual, various members including all of the Moderators were fed up with how the Forum was going, one of them, Tynie decided to look at another option of a new Forum as this current one was in some disarray. Tynie set it up and a few people also joined up and it was then parked in storage until quite recently.
The original Forum was starting to fall apart with it’s technical issues and Craig was nowhere to be found as I have already mentioned, it was thought that in October November last the Forum could actually overload and simply collapse and that we would lose everything, so it seemed sensible to announce that the demise of the Forum was looking to fold and suggesting that this is a new option, not as slick as the original but its free and in time it will be improved, despite the original forum having over 9200 members since day one but in reality only a few 100 active nowadays and of those few hundred the 80-20 rule probably presides where 80% off the postings come from the same 20% off the members!
I think there is a need for both Forums, I shall be on both like a lot of others, the popular Predicter League which is just some good harmless fun [another pet hate by Raymond Adler who commented that most of the posts were about this and nothing much more] was switched over and is as popular as ever, it is hoped that for next season this section can remain with the New Forum.
Lastly, to conclude matters on both Adler and the New Forum, there is no need to have one bad apple in the barrel despite him being good for the hobby in one side but disrespects everyone else who cannot match up to his standards or has as much as him, there are other collectors on both Forums who certainly can not only match him but are far way ahead in many other aspects yet they are not coming on to berate anyone or telling us all I am the greatest ect ect.
Yes it is unfortunate but he is his own worst enemy and no doubt I will be receiving another foul mouthed outburst in a PM to go with others he has sent to me and I am aware that he has also sent to the other Moderators & other Members over the years as well.
As regards the other Forum, collectors will form their own opinions, there will be good chatter on both and it is a shame that this had to happen nothing stands still anymore and as long as there are Forum about the Hobby then it shows it is alive and well and judging by the prices at Auctions these days for the better items that seems to be the case.
Ebay has a lot to answer for as many say, but it has brought out stuff that would perhaps not always been shown and yes it is full of 99p rubbish programmes of course but as shown each month in Programme Monthly there are some very tasty items that appear & prices in general due to ebay have decreased making some aspects of our Hobby much more affordable.

Let us all move on and hope 2020 will see more folk entering the Hobby and having 2 Forums may just encourage new blood which is what our Hobby needs!
NB.
The “ Where there’s one there is not two” thread will not be deleted as even though Bluejames has now been banned AGAIN the thread has many wonderful images that deserve to be seen by as many people as possible.

Cheers, Jamie.
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Eddie Reeve



Joined: 08 Sep 2010
Posts: 123

PostPosted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 7:31 pm 
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Great post, Jamie. Keep up the good work
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Raxfactor



Joined: 16 Jan 2020
Posts: 26

PostPosted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 8:38 pm 
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Although I may be in a minority I am sad to see you saw fit to ban bluejames I didn't find his comments of willy waving offensive I can hear far worse language at any football match at any level, I might not agree with his sentiment of if you've got the biggest d***
flaunt it either.
With all that's going on in the world there must be some pretty thin skins, and I also stand by what I stated before about his comments if they offend ignore and don't bother reading his posts.
I enjoyed his material and his knowledge.
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martino



Joined: 21 Jun 2011
Posts: 1958
Location: Beautiful downtown Goostrey, Cheshire

PostPosted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 9:10 pm 
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Thanks Jamie for the comprehensive update. Much appreciated.
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RoddyN



Joined: 03 Mar 2011
Posts: 308

PostPosted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 10:02 pm 
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I abhor the treatment of Bluejames. It is simply bully boy tactics to ban him. I believe that reference to Two Bob Fish and Chip merchants , Bedroom Bandits etc has been uttered way before he started by another forum member who seems to be able to advertise his wears with no such criticism . It appears that as soon as BlueJames posts something certain people think it is showing off. I think it is very helpful that he shares some of his treasures on this forum as I do with others. The forum will be a duller place without him. I suggest you stop attacking him and he won't attack you. He should be re-instated immediately.
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Dorking



Joined: 05 Feb 2010
Posts: 2029

PostPosted: Mon Jan 27, 2020 7:46 am 
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Bluejames was fine in my opinion. He was sharing loads of interesting stuff, and stimulating a bit of interest.

From time to time we all make 'barbed' comments, myself included. Sometimes I just go off on one about the disappointing lack of other people willing to talk badges! It seems to me like the 'other' forum was just a thinly veiled attempt to have a Ray Adler free zone.

Collecting football tat, as I like to affectionately call it, is a small and niche community, and I would rather have the whole community in one place. In all communities you get rich, poor, boring, interesting, people who contribute, people who lurk and rarely post, some super-helpful, and some super-grumpy, and some people who are more than one of the above.
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Eck



Joined: 25 Aug 2012
Posts: 2482

PostPosted: Tue Jan 28, 2020 2:46 am 
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I have always got on fine with Ray but my niece said to my wife Alex gets on with everyone and it was not a compliment.
l can understand why people are upset with some of his posts, new members in particular but l don't think it's a big deal.
The forum is a good place and i'm impressed with the new one as well and l will use both.
I'm not going to criticise admin for banning Ray l like tthe man and would like him to stay but there is a set of rules and you stick to them or you are gone, l would say that is fair.
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Thedoog10



Joined: 20 Feb 2018
Posts: 201

PostPosted: Tue Jan 28, 2020 1:26 pm 
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Anyone recall Dangerman, i loved him his posts were so funny at times... But it takes all kinds if you dont like someones posts just egnore them. ?
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Dorking



Joined: 05 Feb 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 28, 2020 2:11 pm 
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I think Dangerman (genuinely) had learning difficulties, so when he kept asking the value of low value programmes, he wasn't asking to wind anyone up, he genuinely thought with every acquisition, that he might have struck gold!

And it was easy enough to ignore the posts if they annoyed you
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Eck



Joined: 25 Aug 2012
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 28, 2020 3:44 pm 
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Dangerman is on a few programme groups on facebook under his real name Andrew Sanderson.
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Thedoog10



Joined: 20 Feb 2018
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 28, 2020 3:57 pm 
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Eck wrote:
Dangerman is on a few programme groups on facebook under his real name Andrew Sanderson.

Thanks Eck i wondered if that was him... You could tell by the way he worded is itemes, good to c he is still active.
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Auchinleckian
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Joined: 21 Nov 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:30 pm 
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How many other folk on here receive non complimentary emails from Mr Adler? I know I'm not alone, far from it, as I've conversed with others.

John
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Tynie Topics



Joined: 26 Nov 2009
Posts: 3315

PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2020 7:32 pm 
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Auchinleckian wrote:
How many other folk on here receive non complimentary emails from Mr Adler? I know I'm not alone, far from it, as I've conversed with others.

John


You mean unsolicited, abusive emails? oh yes. Not for 3 years though as I blocked him.
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kcs



Joined: 29 Dec 2008
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Location: Ashford, Kent

PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 12:16 pm 
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I can confirm I have received emails from Ray.

All positive and factual, with a decent conversation regarding our hobby.

A decent guy with a great deal of valuable knowledge whom, is willing to share this knowledge with other collectors.
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RoddyN



Joined: 03 Mar 2011
Posts: 308

PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 6:05 pm 
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He is a top class guy with immense knowledge and has been treated appallingly by forum members for telling the truth.
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rams10



Joined: 05 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:16 pm 
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RoddyN wrote:
He is a top class guy with immense knowledge and has been treated appallingly by forum members for telling the truth.



I do not know Ray personally, but i will agree with this quote from RoddyN.
That he has been treated by certain members appallingly.
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Dorking



Joined: 05 Feb 2010
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:48 pm 
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I don't want this forum to get divisive, but I never had a problem with Ray, always interested in the items I posted and talked about, always happy to share the treasures of his collection, and always honest about the 'pm sent' vultures who circle around unsuspecting people with something to sell
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Posh1959



Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Posts: 1099

PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:12 pm 
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I have to agree with the last few comments about Ray Adler, I always found him to be a likeable guy with a good knowledge and always helpful. It’s a sad world when people dislike someone for telling the truth which he usually did. Banned from the forum for his honesty which some didn’t like.

Good to hear that others feel the same way. Bring back Ray is a good idea, but I guess a few will taunt him to get a reaction.

I have had several emails/ messages from him over the years, never had any problems. I guess he behaves to people the way he is spoken to. Nothing wrong with that just normal reaction.
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grantham



Joined: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 860

PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 11:17 am 
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Thedoog10 wrote:
Anyone recall Dangerman, i loved him his posts were so funny at times... But it takes all kinds if you dont like someones posts just egnore them. ?


Dangerman was impossible to ignore though, nearly every other post was, What is my run of the mill 10p programme worth ? I know they printed 50,000 of them last week, but how rare is it.

Or

I brought a box from auction, now I'm going to list every single item one at a time Smile

Yeah, you are right, looking back it is quite funny, just really annoying at the time
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goonerboy



Joined: 24 Aug 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 12:00 pm 
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RoddyN wrote:
He is a top class guy with immense knowledge and has been treated appallingly by forum members for telling the truth.


I guess it depends who defines and what is defined as "the truth". Too many times he has descended into dishing out personal insults and i suspect he doesnt know enough about most of the forum people for his insulting/derogatory remarks to be "the truth". I dont know the guy other than observing him on the forum. When he contributes positively with his knowledge and sharing his collection he is a great asset to the forum, but when he starts descending into his condescending/derogatory approach then he is not welcome. Just because someone has a different perspective to him it doesnt mean they are wrong and deserve belittling and derision.......there are many ways to view a mountain and they can all be correct !

The question is can a leopard change his spots ?
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