No to Rangers NewCo parachute into SPL

[Drvonshineck]

Could you please take the time to add your name to the following petition.

http://www.petitionbuzz.com/petitions/norangersnewco

[realred]

Completely agree, petition signed

[Fishy]

and me........

[clsyorkshire]

If a new club is formed then they should start at the bottom of the pyramid.

That's what the likes of AFC Wimbledon and FCUM have had to do.
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[Drvonshineck]

That's the major problem with Scottish football at present there is no pyramid but this is something that the fans want changed.

Unfortunately despite numerous proposals, the chairmen and money men of Scottish football favor the opinion of television executives rather than the rank and file supporter.

[Auchinleckian]

You say the fans want a Pyramid. You may speak for the professional game, and maybe the Highland League, but like thousands of Junior fans I'd hate to see it. I love my club, I love the grade of football they play in, and I despise the SPL. Why on earth would I want to have anything to do with that?

[Drvonshineck]

Auchinleckian wrote:

You say the fans want a Pyramid. You may speak for the professional game, and maybe the Highland League, but like thousands of Junior fans I'd hate to see it. I love my club, I love the grade of football they play in, and I despise the SPL. Why on earth would I want to have anything to do with that?

I was speaking for fans of the professional game in general but I also know some junior fans who would welcome such a system also.

For me that is the beautiful of the sport, the opportunity for every dog to have it's day by rising through the leagues.

Look at the various degrees of success the likes of Ross County, Livingston, Annan and Gretna have had, don't tell me you didn't enjoy your trip to Tynecastle?

Also from a point of sporting integrity and basic need for change what is to be achieved by having East Stirling languishing at the bottom of the 3rd division for 5 seasons in a row and then each season playing them 4 times, why would anyone what to maintain such a format?

[Tynie Topics]

As a fan and former club official in Junior football, I'd love to see a proper pyramid established to enable ambitious clubs to realise their potential.

Unfortunately, there are too many dinosaurs in the game who are only interested in themselves and ignore the wider picture.

It WILL happen, it may not be in the next few years though.
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[Auchinleckian]

As you well know, Tynie, it's not about being a dinasour loving a football club and loving the grade of football it plays in. I look at horror at the Pyramid system in England and the ridiculous ground restrictions that progressive clubs need to adhere to to achieve physical promotion out of the leagues they're in.
I look at the likes of great non league clubs like King's Lynn who folded because they couldn't finally fund what they needed to do to progress. I look further back at the likes of Colne Dynamoes who were denied entry to the Conference becasue their ground "wasn't up to it" even though they were the most progressive non league club in the country at the time, and would undoubtedly have gotten into the Football League if it was on playing ability only.
My club, as I've said on here many times, play in probably the highest level of non league football in Scotland. I like that. I pay a fiver to watch this level of football. I like that even more, as do the fans. Auchinleck is a small ex mining community that Thatcher tried to shut down and there is a higher than average unemployment rate, as there has been since the pits shut after the 84-5 strike.
The club brings a sense of pride and identity to the village. Everybody in the community, if you listen to them, are Talbot mad - even though the vast majority don't turn up for anything than the biggest games. Why would I want to prejudice this by having my club joining an ailing body that exists purely to feed gazillions of pounds into the Old Firm? That's the sole raison d'etre of the SFL and SPL, even if a few other clubs occasionally get to feed on the crumbs on offer from them.
I like the occasional foray into the Senior Cup. I can live without it though if it's going to be used as a carrot to try and get my club and others into a Pyramid set up that is nothing to do with the advancement of non league football. We only have to look south of the border to understand that.
Dinosaurs? You're having a blinkered laugh.....

[Tynie Topics]

Auchinleckian wrote:

As you well know, Tynie, it's not about being a dinasour loving a football club and loving the grade of football it plays in. I look at horror at the Pyramid system in England and the ridiculous ground restrictions that progressive clubs need to adhere to to achieve physical promotion out of the leagues they're in. I look at the likes of great non league clubs like King's Lynn who folded because they couldn't finally fund what they needed to do to progress. I look further back at the likes of Colne Dynamoes who were denied entry to the Conference becasue their ground "wasn't up to it" even though they were the most progressive non league club in the country at the time, and would undoubtedly have gotten into the Football League if it was on playing ability only. My club, as I've said on here many times, play in probably the highest level of non league football in Scotland. I like that. I pay a fiver to watch this level of football. I like that even more, as do the fans. Auchinleck is a small ex mining community that Thatcher tried to shut down and there is a higher than average unemployment rate, as there has been since the pits shut after the 84-5 strike. The club brings a sense of pride and identity to the village. Everybody in the community, if you listen to them, are Talbot mad - even though the vast majority don't turn up for anything than the biggest games. Why would I want to prejudice this by having my club joining an ailing body that exists purely to feed gazillions of pounds into the Old Firm? That's the sole raison d'etre of the SFL and SPL, even if a few other clubs occasionally get to feed on the crumbs on offer from them. I like the occasional foray into the Senior Cup. I can live without it though if it's going to be used as a carrot to try and get my club and others into a Pyramid set up that is nothing to do with the advancement of non league football. We only have to look south of the border to understand that. Dinosaurs? You're having a blinkered laugh.....

That is frankly dinosauric I'm afraid, and Talbot have not cornered the market of being a proud wee toon with higher than average unemployment (not that I can see what that has to do with a pyramid).

You enjoy being the big fish in a small pond and crowing about your Junior Cup successes , nothing wrong with that, but these dinosaurs should not hold back progress and block other clubs ambitions.

We do not need to copy England when setting-up a pyramid, why should we? but there is no doubt that there has to be some form of route available to the ambitious clubs in the Juniors and elsewhere [and they do exist] into the league system. If Talbot do not want to be part of that then fair enough.

Look at Ross County who were a smaller club than Talbot in 1992, do their fans want a return to the Highland League?

To defend a system where the likes of East Stirling and Albion Rovers can under perform year after year with no penalty, and where a club like Clydebank have no route available to regain their league place, is frankly ludicrous, and thankfully the SFA are taking steps to at least set the ball rolling on pulling the game into the 21st century. Down south, AFC Wimbledon are an example of why a pyramid should exist.

I have sat in Scottish Junior FA AGM's, and it is a scary place, no need for a time machine back to the 19th century, it's right there in front of you. Scottish football is dying at all levels, it's time we done something about it.
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[jambokev]

The one argument I'd have against sending Rangers down to Division Three is all it would do is deny one team every season for the next three seasons an automatic promotion place. You would have to imagine Rangers would win each of the three divisions quite comfortably.
I would be quite happy to see a new Rangers granted entry into the Scottish Premier League, but only if they received a 15 points deduction for the next three seasons and strict financial limitations, for example either no transfers or capped wages etc.

As for a pyramid system, I'd like to see some sort of Play-Off between the club bottom of the Scottish Third Division and the top Non-League club, with the winner earning a place in the Scottish Football League.

[Tynie Topics]

jambokev wrote:

The one argument I'd have against sending Rangers down to Division Three is all it would do is deny one team every season for the next three seasons an automatic promotion place. You would have to imagine Rangers would win each of the three divisions quite comfortably. I would be quite happy to see a new Rangers granted entry into the Scottish Premier League, but only if they received a 15 points deduction for the next three seasons and strict financial limitations, for example either no transfers or capped wages etc.

That's a fair point, but for the sake of integrity they should be demoted, however integrity is in short supply in the SPL.

Quote:

As for a pyramid system, I'd like to see some sort of Play-Off between the club bottom of the Scottish Third Division and the top Non-League club, with the winner earning a place in the Scottish Football League.

How do you decide the best team? where does the relegated team go? A strong pyramid is required before any SFL club agrees to relegation.
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[Drvonshineck]

If Rangers are liquidated then any newco MUST start in the third division if that means they achieve promotion every season until they are back in the SPL so be it.

Scottish football needs a major overhaul I quite like the idea of 16 team SPL with another 16 in the SPL 2 followed by regional division with 3 teams going up and down from each division including play offs.

This would ensure continued change and prevent things going stale as they currently are.

With regards to bigger divisions I think this is something the fans definitely want and I understand that would mean a greater distribution of wealth which should be encouraged.

Unfortunately when considering this most chairmen purely consider themselves and not Scottish football in general which is incredibly short term thinking an unfortunate feature of our capitalist system.

[Drvonshineck]

Has everyone signed this?