Royal Mail

[Tynie Topics]

Oh my, record profits followed by a threat to the Universal Service, we never saw that one coming did we........

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-27514531
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[Wullie]

Universal Service won't last. It's insane to legally bind a company to deliver to every house in the country whilst competitors can cherry pick the profitable areas .

[Tynie Topics]

I'd say its insane to allow Royal Mail to stop universal service, that is the whole point of them existing and why its a legal obligation, but then we should never have allowed it to be privatised. That's the Tories for you.
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[Wullie]

I'm afraid it's everyone's beloved European Laws that opened up the market. Royal Mail was bound to become a private company regardless of government ( remember Peter Mendelsohn was desperate to privatise it ) Of course people will use anything to try and score a political point.
The fact remains , Royal Mail has to deliver to every household and the likes of TNT and other foreign companies don't . But then there is the EEC for you .
http://www.royalmailgroup.com/cy/node/200

[Tynie Topics]

Wullie wrote:

I'm afraid it's everyone's beloved European Laws that opened up the market. Royal Mail was bound to become a private company regardless of government ( remember Peter Mendelsohn was desperate to privatise it ) Of course people will use anything to try and score a political point. The fact remains , Royal Mail has to deliver to every household and the likes of TNT and other foreign companies don't . But then there is the EEC for you . http://www.royalmailgroup.com/cy/node/200

The Royal Mail was not bound to become private at all, that was just Tory policy (and prob Labours as well, cheeks of the same arse these days). In fact if/when Scotland becomes Independent there is the strong possibility the Scottish operation will be re-nationlised.
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[Wullie]

If you re-nationalise the Royal Mail in Scotland, then as long as Scotland want to be part of Europe, then it will abide by the same law, i.e. a postal service open to competition. In fact Scotland has far more rural communities , so the huge cost of a postal service to these remote areas will be picked up by the Scottish tax payer or a massive increase of postage costs whilst foreign owned companies ( No doubt including Royal Mail UK ) will cherry pick the profitable parts Glasgow ,Edinburgh ,Aberdeen etc.
Talk of re-nationalising a Scottish mail service frankly is nonsense.

[Tynie Topics]

Wullie wrote:

If you re-nationalise the Royal Mail in Scotland, then as long as Scotland want to be part of Europe, then it will abide by the same law, i.e. a postal service open to competition. In fact Scotland has far more rural communities , so the huge cost of a postal service to these remote areas will be picked up by the Scottish tax payer or a massive increase of postage costs whilst foreign owned companies ( No doubt including Royal Mail UK ) will cherry pick the profitable parts Glasgow ,Edinburgh ,Aberdeen etc. Talk of re-nationalising a Scottish mail service frankly is nonsense.

Yep and its those rural communities that are the reason we need to re-nationalise and protect the universal service. That said, the EU requires a minimum of a 5 day delivery service, the UK currently demands 6.

Just looked it up and yes, the intention is to re-nationalise in the event of Yes vote. The majority of Scottish MP's (of all parties) voted against privatisation.
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[pompeypete]

Good discussion...................

Looks like another reason to join UKIP & leave the european union

Mmmm
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Flickr pages in the process of closing......

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[Wullie]

I'm not saying it won't happen , I'm saying the cost of a Scottish delivery service would be massive. That will have to be paid for by the tax payer , a huge increase in postage costs or both. If everyone is happy with that, that's fine... But I think people will need to understand , other companies will pick profitable routes, they are not interested in villages and farms...

[slightfold]

As an aside, I was recently reading that the US postal service which is losing shedfuls of money is stopping doorstop delivery except for disabled people etc. There is much anger over the proposals. They are going to install neighbourhood communal boxes which you would need to go to pick up your mail. The savings will apparently stem the losses and put a smile back on the god of profit.Will this happen here eventually?

[Wullie]

Well if any company is losing " sheds loads of money " then how can it survive ? If the God of profit , pays your wages ,your pension fund then what is the problem ? Why is Royal Mail different from any other company ? I'm guessing most people on the forum go to work each day for a company that makes no money whatsoever by the sound of things The problem Royal Mail have, as I have stated many times , is foreign firms having an unfair advantage .

[Tynie Topics]

Wullie wrote:

Well if any company is losing " sheds loads of money " then how can it survive ? If the God of profit , pays your wages ,your pension fund then what is the problem ? Why is Royal Mail different from any other company ? I'm guessing most people on the forum go to work each day for a company that makes no money whatsoever by the sound of things The problem Royal Mail have, as I have stated many times , is foreign firms having an unfair advantage .

The point being, the Royal Mail should be a public funded service for the benefit of taxpayers, not a PLC looking to cut services and increase profit to shareholders.

The NHS is next.
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[Auchinleckian]

Wullie wrote:

Well if any company is losing " sheds loads of money " then how can it survive ? If the God of profit , pays your wages ,your pension fund then what is the problem ? Why is Royal Mail different from any other company ? I'm guessing most people on the forum go to work each day for a company that makes no money whatsoever by the sound of things The problem Royal Mail have, as I have stated many times , is foreign firms having an unfair advantage .

Wullie, you've answered your own question there. Your pension scheme has been closed to new entrants since 2008, and your final salary scheme - as is - may also go in pursuit of mammon.

The Royal Mail, like the NHS was once under governmental control, but as New Labour showed the way after being guided by Thatcher noting is sacred when it comes to pleasing big business. When we get Independence in Scotland we will return it to governmental control, because that is what is in the best interest of the people. It doesn't need to make a profit, break even and everything's ticketyboo. It's the same reason that Scottish Water is still a public utility, not private. It's why education and the NHS in Scotland are so much more preferable to England because they're controlled by the devolved government. There are some concerns that should never, ever, be opened up to the obscenities of the free market.

I note the Tories are looking to privatise Child Protection now. Just how low can they get when they would even consider putting a child's safety before profit. It would be like Xmas coming early for paedophiles every year were this to happen. It's obscene, but come September 18th with a bit of luck we'll be free from this crap forever.

[Wullie]

The Royal Mail should be a funded public service rather than a business. I think most would agree. Sadly the European Parliament does not agree. Once the Europeans ordered the opening up of the mail service it was the beginning of the end. To be honest complaints today are ten years too late. Like a lot of these things, a small unnoticed law is passed and the effect is not felt until many years later. Of course by then it's too late....

[slightfold]

I know it is stating the bleedin' obvious but all businesses have to be in profit or they go bust, unless they are premiership football clubs. Now the Royal Mail has to accept competition even if they don't like it. If the profits are squeezed then they will do whatever is necessary to the service to keep their margins. In New Zealand you find 3 different post boxes all with different rates!
There are some things which should be sacrosanct but it's too late now, and it was sold off far too cheaply, well well. Mail should be service for all the people not run as a cash cow for shareholders.

[treble99]

How does all of this affect 4 times used envelopes and steamed off unfranked half price stamps

We have a few members who need to know

[Wullie]

treble99 wrote:

How does all of this affect 4 times used envelopes and steamed off unfranked half price stamps We have a few members who need to know

well it's a good point. My observation is that people want a state run delivery service, that they don't have to pay for by re using unfranked stamps. The moment they have to pay for a under paid package they scream blue murder. And while a German firm using a German law picks up profitable parts of the country , they want to post a letter in the Outer Hebrides to Cornwell for 10p to arrive before 7.30 am the next day by Royal Mail because the German company wouldn't touch it with a barge pole.
I get it all the time. People complain about the pizza leaflet they don't want and the other junk mail. What they don't realise is that it subsidises their post. They live in the middle of bloody nowhere. Do they think a company is going to deliver to a tiny village six days a week for one letter a week they get ?

[Tynie Topics]

Wullie wrote:

well it's a good point. My observation is that people want a state run delivery service, that they don't have to pay for by re using unfranked stamps. The moment they have to pay for a under paid package they scream blue murder. And while a German firm using a German law picks up profitable parts of the country , they want to post a letter in the Outer Hebrides to Cornwell for 10p to arrive before 7.30 am the next day by Royal Mail because the German company wouldn't touch it with a barge pole. I get it all the time. People complain about the pizza leaflet they don't want and the other junk mail. What they don't realise is that it subsidises their post. They live in the middle of bloody nowhere. Do they think a company is going to deliver to a tiny village six days a week for one letter a week they get ?

I'd like to think as a society in a fairly rich country we can perhaps provide a consistent daily postal service to all its citizens regardless of where they live, ie a universal delivery service.
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[Wullie]

I'm afraid people just don't get it do they ? I must have said hundred times , about foreign firms picking up the profitable bits and not once has anyone mentioned this. So it looks to me , in general, people are more than happy to let German, Dutch , USA firms make profits for their companies and the tax payer to pick up the bill for the rest. I'll say it once more. Royal Mail no longer has a monopoly on the postal service. Therefore it must be run as a business and not a public service. Once Tony Blair signed the EEC directive on the freedom of the postal service then that was the end. And no amount of moaning will change that now.
The reality is no serious Government would pump millions of pounds in to a postal service that was making a massive loss , whilst foreign owned postal services were making massive profits by picking up the easy to deliver rounds, i.e. the big cities...
The only way of going back to the good old days , is to give back Royal Mail it's monopoly , and as this is against EEC law , then it will never happen.
And this is why UKIP are doing so well now. Not because people are racist , but because now we are just starting to find out the consequences of our membership. And Royal Mail is a excellent example.

[treble99]

i think people do get it but don't like what they got

Th post office has gone from an early guaranteed delivery to "you'll get it when we want to give it to you"
That is often so late in the day it is often useless

We have gone from the old postman who knew everybody on his round and would "correct" a mistake as he knew the recipient to some part times who doesn't give a fcuk
It is not a surprise to get somebody else's mail on a regular basis and therefore i presume vice versa

Every mistake in punished by daft charges
A one or two gram error gets you a card several days later telling you owe more than the missing postage by a distance and sends you to the post office at daft hours when it is hit or miss whether your post is where it says it is on the card or stuck in some box at the end of your street that isn't due back until tomorrow

All in all the service is now that average and that expensive that they have opened the door for all sorts of competition
It is wrong that an overseas company should be allowed to take it over but the post office and its workers only have themselves to blame