so what is a reasonable expectation re p&p & refunds

[goonerboy]

recently have a couple of suboptimal items from ebay and for which condition was worse than described or included a major fault not mentioned. I contacted the sellers and one said send it back and gave me a full refund including original p&p cost. The other only refunded the cost of the programme.

In some ways it is a bit much that I have to incur any costs in sending back the item for a seller lack of proper description but I suppose not many folks will offer return postage refund. However surely I should expect a full refund including original p&p cost where the seller has been at fault in lack of appropriate description after all why should i be liable for p&p both ways.

would be interested in others experiences and practices.

[banleystowles]

If it was a fault not described in the listing, I would say you were entitled for full refund inc p and p costs. I certainly would refund you if I missed something on the description.
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[Kickoff3pm]

I always give a full refund including p&p or replacement your choice.- if I make a mistake in description & a 14 day no quibble return without P&P if you just change your mind.

[martino]

Hi,

If it was a low value item that I sold I would:

- apologise (they would see from my E Bay feedback that it was a "one off"
- tell them to keep the programme
- send a refund of the total cost paid

M

[Auchinleckian]

You are originally out of pocket by cost of item plus postage. You are still out of pocket if only cost of programmes is repaid. Most folk tend to pay full whack, same as I do if one slips through the net.

What really pisses me off are the folk who take the piss with postage. Recently bid on a number of items - 8 autographed team groups - for which the total postage would have been the same for 1 or the 8. Not unreasonably I emailed the guy asking if he'd combine the postage, which would have been £8. He reduced it to £4, and items arrived this morning costing no more than £1.40 some ten days after I'd paid for them. He's reduced the postage cost for me but still ripped me off for £2.60 unnecessarily. He's also left no feedback yet, and I remember the last time I bought two items off him he didn't leave feedback for me until I'd done similar for him. Think there's eight counts of only 1 for his postage costs going on tomorrow.....

[Kickoff3pm]

Auchinleckian wrote:

You are originally out of pocket by cost of item plus postage. You are still out of pocket if only cost of programmes is repaid. Most folk tend to pay full whack, same as I do if one slips through the net. What really pisses me off are the folk who take the piss with postage. Recently bid on a number of items - 8 autographed team groups - for which the total postage would have been the same for 1 or the 8. Not unreasonably I emailed the guy asking if he'd combine the postage, which would have been £8. He reduced it to £4, and items arrived this morning costing no more than £1.40 some ten days after I'd paid for them. He's reduced the postage cost for me but still ripped me off for £2.60 unnecessarily. He's also left no feedback yet, and I remember the last time I bought two items off him he didn't leave feedback for me until I'd done similar for him. Think there's eight counts of only 1 for his postage costs going on tomorrow.....

Not just programmes either, recently bought ink, the cost of postage under £2, the postage wanted £3.99 !! even after pointing this out the seller still wanted the full wack so he got a wack on his feedback profile to !

[banleystowles]

Money is the root of all evil
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[Rafehod]

People tend to charge higher postage rates to cover their costs

Lets take a typical bog standard 1960s programme listed at 99p as a seller my costs incurred are a listing fee 10p final value fee 10p paypal fee (including percentage) 23p hard back envelope 11p and of course a first class stamp 60p.

Total cost £1.14

All sellers are doing is covering their costs. actual price of postage is a lot less but if sellers want to make money they have to charge more because of the above. ebay and paypal fees regrettably are not cheap anymore.

[banleystowles]

Rafehod wrote:

People tend to charge higher postage rates to cover their costs Lets take a typical bog standard 1960s programme listed at 99p as a seller my costs incurred are a listing fee 10p final value fee 10p paypal fee (including percentage) 23p hard back envelope 11p and of course a first class stamp 60p. Total cost £1.14 All sellers are doing is covering their costs. actual price of postage is a lot less but if sellers want to make money they have to charge more because of the above. ebay and paypal fees regrettably are not cheap anymore.

and then buyers leave low star ratings so eBay impose seller restrictions. It's a viscious circle. I have started to explain in the item description that p and p includes cost of stamp, parcel tape, cost of printing invoice, no mention of ebay and paypal fees. To be honest, is it all worth it?
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[banleystowles]

Rafehod wrote:

People tend to charge higher postage rates to cover their costs Lets take a typical bog standard 1960s programme listed at 99p as a seller my costs incurred are a listing fee 10p final value fee 10p paypal fee (including percentage) 23p hard back envelope 11p and of course a first class stamp 60p. Total cost £1.14 All sellers are doing is covering their costs. actual price of postage is a lot less but if sellers want to make money they have to charge more because of the above. ebay and paypal fees regrettably are not cheap anymore.

and then buyers leave low star ratings so eBay impose seller restrictions. It's a viscious circle. I have started to explain in the item description that p and p includes cost of stamp, parcel tape, cost of printing invoice, no mention of ebay and paypal fees. To be honest, is it all worth it?
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[dj0505]

Sadly eBay and most buyers dont care about sellers making money, its just how Much eBay can make and how cheap the item can be bought for that matters.

The feedback system is flawed as all users know, I always send my items within two working days of receipt of payment, pretty reasonable I think, yet still have had a few 1's and 2s left for me, clearly users leave poor marks for reasons of their own, and not in true reflection of the service they have received.

The only way around the postage thing is to price the item postage included and build the costs into the price, obviously this works fine if you are the only seller of that item listed, but doesnt work if you have competition.

With regard to returns, if my fault, I either replace, or tell the seller to keep it if low value and refund in full, or if returned refund in full incl cost of return postage. Of course I try to avoid these situations and have rarely had to issue refunds for these reasons.
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[banleystowles]

dj0505 wrote:

Sadly eBay and most buyers dont care about sellers making money, its just how Much eBay can make and how cheap the item can be bought for that matters. The feedback system is flawed as all users know, I always send my items within two working days of receipt of payment, pretty reasonable I think, yet still have had a few 1's and 2s left for me, clearly users leave poor marks for reasons of their own, and not in true reflection of the service they have received. The only way around the postage thing is to price the item postage included and build the costs into the price, obviously this works fine if you are the only seller of that item listed, but doesnt work if you have competition. With regard to returns, if my fault, I either replace, or tell the seller to keep it if low value and refund in full, or if returned refund in full incl cost of return postage. Of course I try to avoid these situations and have rarely had to issue refunds for these reasons.

And then ebay and paypal take more fees from you that's why ebay love sellers offering free postage
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[dj0505]

banleystowles wrote:

dj0505 wrote: Sadly eBay and most buyers dont care about sellers making money, its just how Much eBay can make and how cheap the item can be bought for that matters. The feedback system is flawed as all users know, I always send my items within two working days of receipt of payment, pretty reasonable I think, yet still have had a few 1's and 2s left for me, clearly users leave poor marks for reasons of their own, and not in true reflection of the service they have received. The only way around the postage thing is to price the item postage included and build the costs into the price, obviously this works fine if you are the only seller of that item listed, but doesnt work if you have competition. With regard to returns, if my fault, I either replace, or tell the seller to keep it if low value and refund in full, or if returned refund in full incl cost of return postage. Of course I try to avoid these situations and have rarely had to issue refunds for these reasons. And then ebay and paypal take more fees from you that's why ebay love sellers offering free postage

Exactly ! and that is another element to be added to the sales price.

Buyers that push for every penny off the cost, will eventually end up paying for it as more and more sellers move to post incl listings, as eBay want.
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[nozer]

banleystowles wrote:

Money is the root of all evil

Actulay its the love of money thats the root of all evil /
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[Auchinleckian]

Post and packaging should reflect the actual cost, so if someone says 99pence then that's what it should hopefully be give or take a few pence. If it's £1.20 or more, charge £1.20. My grouse was being very obviously being overcharged £2.60 pence (and that was being generous, probably £2.75 in reality) so that the seller made profit out of my postage rather than my bids coming in at a higher level.

I have, on occasion, made things post free and added £1 to the starting price if I think it's unlikely to go much above that. I recently did similar with the Brechin vs Rangers programmes and sold them post free with a BIN price. Putting an extra £1 on the starting price for something that will eventually reach much higher than the starting price is self defeating and you end up paying the whole lot anyway.

[Tintowner]

I once sold some items...all BIN at 99p plus £1 p&p.

Somebody else was selling some of the same items for BIN £1.99 and free p&p.

A buyer purchased half a dozen of the £1.99 BIN (total cost £11.94).

He then emailed me and said that rather than pay me £1 p&p on all the items i was selling, he decided to opt for the free p&p from the other seller.

I didnt know if he was being serious, but I emailed him back and told him that I offered multiple purchase p&p discounts and would have only charged him about £7.25 in total.

[Auchinleckian]

Going to Southport?

[Tintowner]

[quote="Auchinleckian"]Going to Southport?[/quote

Certainly am (at this moment in time)

Was going to stop over on the saturday night, but because of a family function on the evening, that had the kaboosh put on that.

Plan B was to have a Friday night there instead but it looks as if I wont be finishing work until about 8pm.

Still, its only tuesday, and in my game, things can change.

[banleystowles]

Tintowner wrote:

I once sold some items...all BIN at 99p plus £1 p&p. Somebody else was selling some of the same items for BIN £1.99 and free p&p. A buyer purchased half a dozen of the £1.99 BIN (total cost £11.94). He then emailed me and said that rather than pay me £1 p&p on all the items i was selling, he decided to opt for the free p&p from the other seller. I didnt know if he was being serious, but I emailed him back and told him that I offered multiple purchase p&p discounts and would have only charged him about £7.25 in total.

Touche!
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[Auchinleckian]

[quote="Tintowner"]

Auchinleckian wrote:

Going to Southport?[/quote Certainly am (at this moment in time) Was going to stop over on the saturday night, but because of a family function on the evening, that had the kaboosh put on that. Plan B was to have a Friday night there instead but it looks as if I wont be finishing work until about 8pm. Still, its only tuesday, and in my game, things can change.

Will be there Friday night, imbibing in the Guest House real ale pub, so if you're going to be going on the Friday night you ken where I'll be. Won't have a carnation for recognition purposes though....