How can Scottish premiership survive?

[holtie96]

2770 the huge attendance for the St Johnstone v hearts premiership match yesterday. I appreciate that Scotland is a big country with a relatively small population but how can Scottish football survive in it's current form when an attendance of 2770 occurs? Why in earth wasn't ut packed with kids for a quid or something similar? The majority of third division English league and a large number of conference games attract more people than this!

[sharrowblade]

The simple answer Holtie is that it can't.

The numbers simply don't add up.
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A Sheffield United Programme guide

[Tynie Topics]

As ever it’s a whole host of factors. First of all, 12.00pm kick-off on a Sunday is hardly likely to have people flocking to the game, which is also live on TV, although 711 Hearts fans made the trip and all credit to them. The game shoots itself in the foot in that respect. Also bear in mind that Perth is a city of less than 50,000 inhabitants, although 2,000 home fans is frankly dire, I recall being at McDairmid Park in the 1990’s when Hearts were visiting and fans were locked out as the place was full. Price is also a big factor, average ticket prices for SPL games run from £18-£24 which is overpriced – just like English fitba (I paid £20 for Bradford City v Wimbledon on Saturday, ludicrous).

The overriding factor though is boredom and lack of competition. We know who is going to win the league and we know who is going to finish second, the league is only 12 teams and whilst most fans want it expanded to 16/18 teams playing each other twice, those that run the clubs have absolutely no long term vision and some even wanted to reduce back to 10! Playing clubs 4 times a season (and even more if you draw them in one of the cups) is what puts many people off. The Old Firm will not give up their 4 games a season, and some clubs will not give up the hope of 4 visits a season from OF fans.

To go back to ticket prices, a few years back Motherwell reduced prices to attract fans, many games were £10 or less, it basically bankrupted them as there was little upturn in crowd figures. There were probably more buses leaving Motherwell every week packed with Rangers and Celtic “fans” than extra people through the gate at Fir Park. The concept of the Old Firm glory hunter is a big one in Scotland.

The drip drip drip effect of lack of competition, boredom, poor value for money and live TV is killing the game. Sadly, we have people running the SPL who have no concept of what fans want, and when they take time to listen they basically ignore. They won’t realise until it’s too late, and we’re fast approaching that point.
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[Auchinleckian]

Fully concur with that analysis, spot on. We had an away support approaching 350 for our visit to Lossiemouth in the Scottish Cup on Saturday, for a game that's a 450 mile round trip. Half the SPL clubs wouldn't match that away from home at that distance - and there's the rub. For us it's only our second bash at the Scottish Cup so it's still fairly novel, hence the decent away following.
Home tie next round please....

[James]

To be fair though Holtie, i'm thinking that some English teams in the Championship must be close to going to the wall, you watch Soccer Saturday and when they go to a commentator at the game and you look behind them there are just thousands upon thousands of empty seats as the ticket prices are so high and for entertainment value you are probably better off watching ceefax at some games.

My local team are Gillingham and for an adult to watch a home game you are looking at £20/£23 for a ticket to watch fourth tier English football (and probably end up with neck ache watching all the lump it forward tactics), I'm sorry but for £20/£23 I can go watch an ice Hockey match, have a beer and buy a programme and then go to catch a movie at the cinema as well and still have enough left over for a KFC afterwards (granted it's not the healthy option but cheaper that the restaurants) so a

football game where you get 1h 45mins of entertainment

or for the same price

an Ice Hockey Game 2h 15/3h and a movie 1h45/2h entertainment, food, beer and a programme, so an extra 3 hours worth (at least 3 hours) of entertainment as well as food and drink for the same price of going to my local football game, i think my choice woudl be obvious

Now i;m sure other people will have their own intersts but i;m hearing more and more people fed up with the ridiculous money in football and the amount that they are charged for it that they are going elsewhere with their money to be entertained especially as times are still tight
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Maidstone/Tottenham fan

[James]

To back up what i was saying here are the details of this weekend's Championships games:

Brighton V Leeds (Televised) attendance 20,646 - 92.27% full
Birmingham V Barnsley 17,836 - 59.43% full
Bristol City V Hull 12,254 - 57.00%
Burnley V Southampton 14,170 - 62,85%
Coventry V Reading 12,309 - 37.74%
Derby V Millwall 24,120 - 71.79%
Doncaster v Crystal Palace 9,362 - 61.47%
Middlesbrough V Ipswich 17,741 - 50.54%
Portsmouth V Blackpool 14,935 - 72.19%
West Ham V Peterborough 29,895 - 83.86%
Watford V Nott'm Forest 11,437 - 57.41%
Cardiff V Leicester (Televised) 21,154 - 78.85%

So with the exception of West Ham, the two televised games attracted the best attendances in terms of filling the stadiums, which really did surprise me.

Coventry V Reading i would have expected a big crowd for a game with two teams being relatively near to each other, but only 37.74% of teh stadium was in use, the rest was empty seating
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Maidstone/Tottenham fan

[Dorking]

I support Palace, and get good value from my season ticket, but 10 and more years ago I used to regularly also go to lower league games in and around London when Palace weren't playing - for example games at Brentford, Barnet, Orient (and even 4th Diviosion Fulham back in the mid 90s!)

To see a 4th tier game standing on a terrace used to be under a tenner now these games cost double that, it puts off the casual intersted visitor - I'd rather save that £20 than pay to see a game I only have a passing interest in.

[Tynie Topics]

Dorking wrote:

To see a 4th tier game standing on a terrace used to be under a tenner now these games cost double that,

£15 at Wimbledon.
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[Kickoff3pm]

I don't have a clue but how many Scottish players were playing ?

[highlandjambo]

Tynie Topics spot on there mate, been a Jambo for 50years I dont go very often now you have also price of getting there usually 25 quid on supporters bus for me. I was at the Caley game a couple of weeks ago and I have to say its the worst Hearts team I have seen, also couple that with a defeat at Ayr its no wonder supporters dont fork out there hard earned dosh for watching football that is DIRE. End of rant. Happiness is being a Jambo.

[Tynie Topics]

Kickoff3pm wrote:

I don't have a clue but how many Scottish players were playing ?

St.Johnstone v Hearts? probably 13/14 out of the 22 that started the game, and 4 out of the 5 subs that came on.
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[Auchinleckian]

We don't have any Ukranians or other eastern Europeans at Auchinleck

[silkman1]

Ah - but how many speak English Ian.

[GlasgowGuy]

I noticed the attendance for the Aberdeen - Dunfermline game tonight was 8,333. Success?