Well done Wigan Athletic

[Pete’s Picture Palace]

So after the Newport and Rochdale FA Cup threads, here's one to Wigan...

Brilliant.

Mind you, not the first time they've turned City over.

[bluefatnose]

Pete’s Picture Palace wrote:

So after the Newport and Rochdale FA Cup threads, here's one to Wigan... Brilliant. Mind you, not the first time they've turned City over.

Will Grigg's On Fire, nah nah nah nah nah nah...............

[Flackwell Lad]

Now maybe everyone will get off Tottenham's back, this game is the real shock. Ten of the Man City players in this game played in the champions league against Basel last week, six Tottenham players from the Rochdale game played against Juventus last week. Spurs are a well oiled machine in the premier league, when you replace some of those parts with something slightly inferior it's never going to run as smooth even if they are all Internationals. Don't get me wrong, they were great results for both Newport and Rochdale and good luck to Dale in the replay, but you really have to put these results in the proper context. As for Deli being a diver and a cheat, all I can think of is he's been watching some video's of Man Utd players of the past, Ronaldo was and still is a great diver, Rooney, Pogba...and who can forget Welsh wizzard Micky Thomas and his famous dive when he even had the cheek to wink at the camera. Diver's should be sent off if guilty and receive a longer suspension than normal for a red card, that's the only way you're going to stamp it out

[Five and In]

Firstly, well done to Wigan for a terrific result

Personally, I will take more satisfaction is seeing that smug look being wiped off of Guardiola's face, even if it is only for a little while.

[Dorking]

Guardiola (sp?) was really rattled, even at half time after the sending off - saw him losing it in the tunnel thanks to tunnel-cam!

Wigan stewards dropped one not sealing off the front of the away stand quickly enough after the pitch invasion though

[pompeypete]

Well done Wigan.......

Now beat that stripey team from down the road to me.


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[littlewiggy]

bluefatnose wrote:

Pete’s Picture Palace wrote: So after the Newport and Rochdale FA Cup threads, here's one to Wigan... Brilliant. Mind you, not the first time they've turned City over. Will Grigg's On Fire, nah nah nah nah nah nah...............

... Your defence is terrified ... nah nah nah nah nah


(best footy song in years!! )


Well played Wigan, fantastic performance and a brilliant cup tie!


PS. Did Dave Whelan mention that he broke his leg??


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[manchesterunitedman1]

Flackwell Lad wrote:

Now maybe everyone will get off Tottenham's back, this game is the real shock. Ten of the Man City players in this game played in the champions league against Basel last week, six Tottenham players from the Rochdale game played against Juventus last week. Spurs are a well oiled machine in the premier league, when you replace some of those parts with something slightly inferior it's never going to run as smooth even if they are all Internationals. Don't get me wrong, they were great results for both Newport and Rochdale and good luck to Dale in the replay, but you really have to put these results in the proper context. As for Deli being a diver and a cheat, all I can think of is he's been watching some video's of Man Utd players of the past, Ronaldo was and still is a great diver, Rooney, Pogba...and who can forget Welsh wizzard Micky Thomas and his famous dive when he even had the cheek to wink at the camera. Diver's should be sent off if guilty and receive a longer suspension than normal for a red card, that's the only way you're going to stamp it out

Why did you choose to mention 4 Manchester United players as regards alleged diving, are they the only other club that has affected a penalty claim allegedly by "tricking" the referee? over the last 50 years?

TELL ME WHICH TEAM HAS NEVER WON A DECISION BY CONNING THE OFFICIALS, go on then, who is it?, even Snotrag United who play in the outer Hebrides and whose home average attendance is 4 old men and 2 chickens try it on[please do not google them].

Well Done Wigan!

Looks like the Rabbits they have been pulling out of hats this season in the last minutes of games must have been away on holiday this week.

The bigger you are, the harder you fall

There are a lot of smug football people around this morning who will be keeping their gobs firmly shut!, that right Arsene, Jose?.







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[Flackwell Lad]

manchesterunitedman1 wrote:

Flackwell Lad wrote: Now maybe everyone will get off Tottenham's back, this game is the real shock. Ten of the Man City players in this game played in the champions league against Basel last week, six Tottenham players from the Rochdale game played against Juventus last week. Spurs are a well oiled machine in the premier league, when you replace some of those parts with something slightly inferior it's never going to run as smooth even if they are all Internationals. Don't get me wrong, they were great results for both Newport and Rochdale and good luck to Dale in the replay, but you really have to put these results in the proper context. As for Deli being a diver and a cheat, all I can think of is he's been watching some video's of Man Utd players of the past, Ronaldo was and still is a great diver, Rooney, Pogba...and who can forget Welsh wizzard Micky Thomas and his famous dive when he even had the cheek to wink at the camera. Diver's should be sent off if guilty and receive a longer suspension than normal for a red card, that's the only way you're going to stamp it out Why did you choose to mention 4 Manchester United players as regards alleged diving, are they the only other club that has affected a penalty claim allegedly by "tricking" the referee? over the last 50 years? TELL ME WHICH TEAM HAS NEVER WON A DECISION BY CONNING THE OFFICIALS, go on then, who is it?, even Snotrag United who play in the outer Hebrides and whose home average attendance is 4 old men and 2 chickens try it on[please do not google them]. Well Done Wigan! Looks like the Rabbits they have been pulling out of hats this season in the last minutes of games must have been away on holiday this week. The bigger you are, the harder you fall There are a lot of smug football people around this morning who will be keeping their gobs firmly shut!, that right Arsene, Jose?. The only reason I mentioned them was I happened to be looking at a video on youtube called 'The Man Utd school of diving'...there were other players in the video not just those four. As you rightly pointed out Les every team has had a player dive to get a favourable decision. What I don't get is why people seem to be always be picking out Deli Alli....is it because his success rate is higher than most other divers? But seriously Les...what about that Micky Thomas dive...wink wink.

[Flaming Pie]

A bit of a rarity is when a player pleads with the ref not to give a penalty to his own team. .Robbie Fowler ,Arsenal v Liverpool 1997. Apparently Fowler was given a right bollocking by the Reds management ( and supporters) for telling the ref to not award the pen. The ref stood by his decision.Fowler stepped up and his poor penalty was saved by Seaman.McAteer put in the rebound.Fowler was awarded a commendation from UEFA for his honesty. I bet even greats like Matthews, Finney and Best were called divers in their day, when really their speed of thought was too quick for the defenders, who were too busy trying to kick lumps out of them! What's that Whelan broken leg story Wiggy? He keeps that one quiet😂

[Fishy]

Dorking wrote:

Wigan stewards dropped one not sealing off the front of the away stand quickly enough after the pitch invasion though

Just imagine if that had been at Millwall - we'd have been hung drawn and quartered by this morning. Not the first pitch invasion that the media hasn't gone to town on this season! Rant over.

Well done Wigan! Really enjoyed watching the match and wish you the best of luck going forward.
_________________
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45/6 Newport; Swansea; Leicester.
47/8 Coventry.
48/9 Newport.
49/0 Walsall; Exeter.
50/1 Port Vale.
51/2 Port Vale 1/5.
52/3 Swindon.

[Eck]

Tottenham are still in the cup and I fancy them to win it.

[manchesterunitedman1]

Eck wrote:

Tottenham are still in the cup and I fancy them to win it.

Well they are guaranteed all home games from now on!!!!

They will not win it . Manchester United will now that City are out.

That is my opinion and i fancy them to be drawn against Spurs at some point provided of course both get through the 6th round.
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[Five and In]

manchesterunitedman1 wrote:

Well they are guaranteed all home games from now on!!!!

Apart from the trip to Swansea or Sheffield Wednesday, assuming we take care of Rochdale

[littlewiggy]

Flaming Pie wrote:

A bit of a rarity is when a player pleads with the ref not to give a penalty to his own team. .Robbie Fowler ,Arsenal v Liverpool 1997. Apparently Fowler was given a right bollocking by the Reds management ( and supporters) for telling the ref to not award the pen. The ref stood by his decision.Fowler stepped up and his poor penalty was saved by Seaman.McAteer put in the rebound.Fowler was awarded a commendation from UEFA for his honesty. I bet even greats like Matthews, Finney and Best were called divers in their day, when really their speed of thought was too quick for the defenders, who were too busy trying to kick lumps out of them! What's that Whelan broken leg story Wiggy? He keeps that one quiet😂

He's football's equivalent of Uncle Albert and the war Pie, in that he doesn't like talking about it.


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[Flaming Pie]

Wiggy, l was going to put up a new thread. Something like ' Hard Luck Manchester City .You Put Up A Champion Display', but l thought l better start taking this football lark seriously. 😈

[manchesterunitedman1]

Flackwell Lad wrote:

manchesterunitedman1 wrote: Flackwell Lad wrote: Now maybe everyone will get off Tottenham's back, this game is the real shock. Ten of the Man City players in this game played in the champions league against Basel last week, six Tottenham players from the Rochdale game played against Juventus last week. Spurs are a well oiled machine in the premier league, when you replace some of those parts with something slightly inferior it's never going to run as smooth even if they are all Internationals. Don't get me wrong, they were great results for both Newport and Rochdale and good luck to Dale in the replay, but you really have to put these results in the proper context. As for Deli being a diver and a cheat, all I can think of is he's been watching some video's of Man Utd players of the past, Ronaldo was and still is a great diver, Rooney, Pogba...and who can forget Welsh wizzard Micky Thomas and his famous dive when he even had the cheek to wink at the camera. Diver's should be sent off if guilty and receive a longer suspension than normal for a red card, that's the only way you're going to stamp it out Why did you choose to mention 4 Manchester United players as regards alleged diving, are they the only other club that has affected a penalty claim allegedly by "tricking" the referee? over the last 50 years? TELL ME WHICH TEAM HAS NEVER WON A DECISION BY CONNING THE OFFICIALS, go on then, who is it?, even Snotrag United who play in the outer Hebrides and whose home average attendance is 4 old men and 2 chickens try it on[please do not google them]. Well Done Wigan! Looks like the Rabbits they have been pulling out of hats this season in the last minutes of games must have been away on holiday this week. The bigger you are, the harder you fall There are a lot of smug football people around this morning who will be keeping their gobs firmly shut!, that right Arsene, Jose?. The only reason I mentioned them was I happened to be looking at a video on youtube called 'The Man Utd school of diving'...there were other players in the video not just those four. As you rightly pointed out Les every team has had a player dive to get a favourable decision. What I don't get is why people seem to be always be picking out Deli Alli....is it because his success rate is higher than most other divers? But seriously Les...what about that Micky Thomas dive...wink wink.

Deli Ali is the epitomy of how many millionaire footballers act today.
He looks arrogant he thinks he is "da man", you can see it all over him. He has no humility and does not have the sense to know how he is carrying on. His manager is completely irresponsible in firstly giving an opinion on Diving and then explaining to us all that he sees nowt wrong with players who deceive the officials and trick them but that is HIS mentality as that is the way they play football from where he comes from, it is their mode de employ.

Manchester United in 1968 played 2 legs for the World Club Championship in Buenos Aires and Manchester v Estudiantes de la Plata. United had one or two in their side who if called upon were not backwards at going forwards if you wanted a ruck, Crerand, Stiles, Law, Best never flinched from retaliation if they had been upended but the Estudiantes players were Actors and the rolling over and the feigning, even the crying literally to the ref to get a player sent off. In the return leg Best was hacked down so many times by the same player he tried it once too many times and Best lamped him one and they both got sent off-the Estudiantes player holding his jaw, his knee ,his leg,his back, his eyes and crying to the ref to have Best put up against a wall and shot-that was 15 mins from the end at the final whistle when United equalised the tie but the ref said he had blown the United team accepted defeat and trudged off the pitch in front of 63,000. The Estudiantes team went crazy none more so was broken jaw, lost one eye, cracked ribs, dislocated shoulder who was the first on the pitch to taunt the United players and lead the celebrations-long winded tale-yes, moral to the story-ask yer man Poch as this is how those players play and if you teach that way as he is clearly doing with Ali who threw himself to the ground at Rochdale as the defender had made some contact then this is why he is found out and professional players will not like this and refs will certainly mark his card but the most important point in all of this is that the snot nosed Ali who has never won a thing yet thinks he is the dogs bollocks, luckily for him Vinnie Jones stopped playing a while ago as did many others who would have "removed" him as a threat after 2 minutes of the game.

Said my peace-no need to reply

Deli Ali does not look a nice guy and besides his Mother who loves him I do not think many others are in line and every Spurs fan who does not like what I say-imagine that snot nose played for Arsenal-Chelsea-City-Liverpool or even MU and then tell me you think he is ok.

https://flic.kr/p/eFC5Fj


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[manchesterunitedman1]

Five and In wrote:

manchesterunitedman1 wrote: Well they are guaranteed all home games from now on!!!! Apart from the trip to Swansea or Sheffield Wednesday, assuming we take care of Rochdale

yes that is correct, I would think Swansea will get through and host Spurs. Take out Hit man Kane and the brains of the team with Erikson I think they struggle-well who wouldn't as these two are incredible players but a team is made up of 11 not 2.

The right attitude has to emanate from the manager IMO especially when faced with being drawn away to lower league teams, the top players have to roll up their sleeves and get the result as befits their standing and some times they do and still do not get through the first time and sometimes they do not and underestimate their opponents.

Tottenham and Manchester City players believed they just had to turn up at Newport and Wigan and after that scare at Newport Tottenham players probably groaned and being drawn to Rochdale[as if any of them even knew where it was I bet!] yet their manager has not been able to instill ANYTHING into them as to how top top players on mega bucks a week should be able to handle a team from 3 divisions lower-so for me Poch is another guy who has won nowt either and if the unthinkable happened and Rochdale won at Wembley the reverberations throught football would be immense.

Mourinho sent out a strong team against Yeovil and learned from his mistakes by allowing Bristol City[no mugs at all and only one division lower] to end up with a last minute winner, it was not a case of making wholesale changes which he did but the second team had sufficient skill and talent to do the job, Klop has also come a cropper in his time and recently allowed WBA to beat them at home-another case of not sending the right messages to the players as well as the players being arrogant thinking they only have to turn up.

Anyway got another rant coming up soon about another subject-MANNERS or the total lack of them.
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[Goalsandwickets]

On diving in the past, one well known ex pro from the 60's and 70's told me that 65% of his penalties were achieved by him diving.

Francis Lee now certainly has an image when looking back, of winning penalties through dives. The references to Lee Won Pen have been quoted a few times in various places recently.

So we know it went on.

But I think it's a question of degree.

I am too young to have seen Matthews etc, although I doubt they either fell in the way current players do or hassled the referee for a penalty afterwards.

The only clip I've seen of Tom Finney showed him cutting through defenders like a knife through butter. As with Matthews and others, he was almost TOO quick to get caught.

Also, as a fascinating comparison film of the 57 and 07 FA Cup Finals made a few years back showed, the play back then was much more rugged with more contact and seemingly accepted contact too.

The game was refereed differently and as the film showed, defending players had to commit what would now be considered Yellow card challenges at minimum just for a foul to be awarded.

In the 57 final, the ref blew for a free kick after 3 minutes; in 07, the first foul was awarded after 30 seconds.

As for Best, I did see him play as I grew up both on TV and in his last season with United, live at QPR in 73/4 when he was marked by the excellent Dave Clement (RIP). Interestingly, there's a clip of Dave on Youtube where it looks suspiciously like one of today's dives where he won a penalty.

My memory of George from back then but also from re-watching many Youtube clips is that he did everything to stay standing; the ferocious tackle that Chelsea's Ron Harris launched on him in the FA Ciup tie at Old Trafford being a prime example.

Today, if a tackle like Chopper's came in, the forward would be writhing on the deck; but back then (early 70's), Best stayed up in order to feint past the goalie and hit the ball into the empty net.

For me, it may well be time for Law 12 and how it is interpreted to be re-written. The issue is this one of contact. There is a difference between contact being made and contact being made in a way which actually affects the contacted player sufficiently for his balance to go and for him to fall over as a result. yet most of the time, you'll hear people say, 'But there was contact'.

A mate of mine who runs a very good junior club where the top team has now gone into Step 6 non league football, told me that he told all his players to fall on contact.

If this is what coaches are telling our young players, what many of us consider to be diving will only get worse, not better as the next generation all mature doing it as a standard action.

On the Deli one at Dale, watching it live, it looked like he WAS clipped. But I've seen a different angle on Twitter where it looks like he wasn't and went flying as he went past the defender.

Many pundits / fans seem to say about players, 'He was touched' when to me, it doesn't look like the defender got anywhere near the player.

Maybe it's time I went back to Specsavers?

In the Chelsea / Hull game last Friday, for the Hull penalty, it was very clear that the Chelsea defenders leg made a solid contact into the Hull attacker's leg, thereby tripping him up. You could see the attackers leg being displaced.

Unfortunately, with Deli's examples, it rarely looks like any sort of contact has been made.

Go figure.

[Flaming Pie]

Goalsandwickets , you make some interesting points. Are you at liberty to name the club ( or city) that the player you talked to came from? You will know this, but in the 1960's they didn't really have the technology to analyse key decisions in games. From what l remember, even the1966 Hurst (was it over the line) goal in the final was not overly analysed at the time. Until Shankly, then Allison and Clough, l don't even recall top managers like Busby, Revie, Nicholson and Catterick being interviewed that much. I recently read a biography of Harry Catterick and it dawned on me that l had hardly ever heard the man speak! Key decisions in the modern game really do come under close scrutiny.. The likes of the recent Spurs penalty incident , and all the bad feeling it created, will probably be here to stay.