(Northern) Irish completists

[Sir Moses Hill]

Let's talk about completists in (Northern) Irish programme collecting. I'm not referring to Europeans or cup finals or friendlies or other specials. I'm talking about domestic seasons - homes certainly and maybe all homes and aways.

This is clearly a very popular form of collecting among fans of English and Scottish clubs, but it strikes me that with (Northern) Irish clubs being much smaller than your average English or top level Scottish club, and therefore the collecting pool being smaller, there just isn't enough critical mass to make domestic completism a realistic target, except for seasons from, say, the eighties onwards.

For my own club - Glentoran - completing homes in the mid-late sixties seasons is probably realistic because crowds were relatively huge, print-runs large, and an all-time successful team meant that programmes were hoarded as souvenirs. But then the seventies came along - the team was less successful and crowds dropped significantly, mainly due to the impact of the Troubles, and so programmes from this decade are much harder to come by. Things pick up again in the eighties and the programmes from this era onwards are robust and plentiful. Maybe I'm talking myself into believing that completing seasons from the mid sixties onwards is realistic, with some gaps for the bad years of the seventies. I don't know.

What are everyone else's thoughts on this? Any (Northern) Irish completists here?

[nozer]

Really good point Moses, I guess my collection is different than any other poster on site has i only collect programmes from the career of my all time footballing hero the late Derek Dougan ( playing span 1954 to 1975)

The Doog started his career at Belfast Distillery 54 i have been trying to obtain a programme from every game he played in at BD so far i have obtained 32 from some 73 games he featured in covering seasons 54 to 57 before he moved to Portsmouth.

I pick up the odd one hear and there of ebay but i know it will be neigh on impossible to complete this collection has i dont really know if some teams even issued this era ... but it dose not stop me checking every day in the hope of adding too.

[seand]

My team, Dundalk, have barely missed a programe for a home game since the early 40s but there are periods that are proving very hard to fill. Back to the mid-70s is ok, but early 70s and most of the 60s is trickier. The latter half of the 50s is esier to fill than the early 70s. Away from home often it's hard even to know if programes were issued. Many clubs had lengthy periods when they produced nothing, or else produced 1 or 2 programmes a season. This includes big clubs like Bohemians and Shamrock Rovers.

I've a detailed spreadsheet listing all our games to tick off wehn I have the programe, know that a programme exists or know for sure that nothing was produced, but you can never be sure! I presume you have something similiar Moses?

Personally I'm complete at home back to 91-2 and 95% complete back to 76-7.

[garyspain]

Sean, I reckon Dundalk go back to at least 38/9 for regular issues and sporadic issues are known before then. Indeed I suspect they were probably regular issuers before then but a comprehensive collection from 1938/39-1945/46 turned up approx 20 years ago. I got the 9 Limerick aways in the collection albeit still need another 9 v Limerick in that period.

I agree it is very difficult to catalogue and collect any club from this island.

My club Limerick have issued regularly from 1937/38 (our first season) apart from

75/6 (no issues)
76/77 (issued in 2nd half of the season)
77/78 (no issues)
78/78 (one early issue v Cork Celtic).

52/53 may have only seen issues for the FAI Cup.

Some clubs seem to have had very low printruns at certain times.

There are some gaps in my homes when others from that season turn up regularly. Either non issues or programmes not sold.

Programme collecting on this island really started in the early 1950's.

Even then some clubs were not collected. away fans were not common (apart from cup ties) even up until the 1980s.

Even today collecting some clubs is a total nightmare. There are away games I dare not miss.

[seand]

Cheers Gary,

Didn't Limerick miss a full season (or most of a season) in the early noughties, maybe 2003?

Another good reason for staying out of the First Division is the difficulty in obtaining programes at away matches!

I have sporadic notes and bits n pieces of information on my laptop, some of these days I'll contact yourself and some of the other old reliables, and see about compiling it all

[garyspain]

We definitely missed a Dundalk game (I don't recall the year) in the first division but I don't recall us missing a full season. I'm pretty certain we didn't although I remember games much better from the 1970's and 1980's than those in the past 25 years.

There have been many changes of editor early/late season non issues or just mixups. However by and large we have issued programmes for most games.

[Sir Moses Hill]

Quote:

I've a detailed spreadsheet listing all our games to tick off wehn I have the programe, know that a programme exists or know for sure that nothing was produced, but you can never be sure! I presume you have something similiar Moses?

Oh yes, with lots of pretty colour coding and detailed notes. It actually looks quite professional and so sits on my second screen in the office for most of the day and my boss is fooled into thinking it's something professional. But at present it only covers Europeans, Detroit Cougars, friendlies against non-Irish opposition and Irish Cup finals. The domestic section is quite substantial but limited to listing the domestics I own, rather than checking them off against those known to be issued. This is because my focus has only recently turned to bulking up my domestic home collection rather than merely trying to have a handful from each season, important games, older-the-better etc. I suppose this thread was intended to fish as to whether domestic completion is a realistic goal. This, of course, has added complexity for me given I live in the US.

[seand]

garyspain wrote:

We definitely missed a Dundalk game (I don't recall the year) in the first division but I don't recall us missing a full season.

I knew there was a non-issue for one Limerick-Dundalk game, I thought it was part of a season (or half a season) of non-issues for Limerick, but I've no idea why I have that in my head, so I'll bow to you superior knowledge!

[FinnHarpsHistory]

Finn Harps have been fairly prolific producers of programmes except for the following seasons:

75/76 Very sporadic season not all games had programmes
76/77 None produced
77/78 None produced
78/79 None produced except Everton in UEFA Cup
79/80 None produced
80/81 None produced bar Athlone Town in FAI Cup
81/82 None produced bar Bohemians in League
82/83 Teamsheets only, which thankfully I have a complete set
83/84; 84/85 and 85/86 Mixture of programmes and teamsheets
86/87 no programmes initially and then a mixture of programmes and teamsheets.
Since that time most competiive games have been catered for.