Postcard 1915 - which team?

[martino]

In a box of postcards I found the attached. I am not sure if it is a football team but here is what I know already:

Posted in Kristiania (now Oslo), Norway - handstamp is very feint but it looks like "19 v 15" (stamp was issued in 1914).

Message includes "This is a photo of our team taken in Copenhagen. We won our last two matches easily"

Addressed to a Mr Sugg in Anerley, South East London.

Signed by Alec or could be Alex L.

As I said it may not be football but do any members know of teams that were touring in Denmark and Norway in May 1915?

Any assistance / suggestions welcomed.

Thanks, Martin

[Pete’s Picture Palace]

Hi Martin

I'm just guessing but doubt very much any teams would be undertaking tours in Europe in 1915.

However, in May 1914 Crystal Palace went on tour to Copenhagen and Gothenburg.

I'm not saying this is Palace for sure but if you could please email those cards to me as jpegs I'll have a good look at the faces. Anerley is just down the road (literally) from the old Crystal Palace.

This website is brilliant for this sort of info:-

http://www.rsssf.com/tablesb/brit-ier-tours-prewwii.html

Cheers!

[Pete’s Picture Palace]

Got as far as L on that website and Clapton Orient & Liverpool were also touring Denmark & Sweden in May 1914.....

[Pete’s Picture Palace]

.... as did Heart Of Midlothian in June 1914

[nutfield priory]

Hi Martin

Can confirm the postcard is of the Crystal Palace team on tour in May 1914.

Will let you have more details later today when I will look them up at home

[Pete’s Picture Palace]

This could get interesting...............

[Dorking]

Just seen this!!!!

I have the same exact same postcard (not the same writing on the back). I always thought it was probably from the Crystal Palace tour to Prague in May 1908????

My one was one of many items that belonged to Crystal Palace goalkeeper Josh Johnson. Quite a collection of his stuff (mostly postcards but also an ancient ticket for his testimonial, a yearbook and some photos of him) surfaced about 10 years ago.

My one has 'Prague' written on the back. by Johnson, so I assumed it was the Palace tour there which I thought was 1908.

I did an attempt at a translation, and the wording on the stand means

"To numbered seats
from 15 - 40

and

"To in-numbered seats
5 best bank (tier)

"Billets" = tickets


Originally 90% or more of the collection was hoovered up by a Palace collector Ron Daughtry, and there was an article (or two?) about it in Palace Echo showing off some of the best bits, however he sold it off piece by piece about 5 or so years ago, and I got quite a lot of decent stuff from it.

I have a second postcard from the same tour - the other one is also with a stand in the background but with everyone in kits. It also says 'Prague' (written by Johnson) on the back.

In the pic above I believe Josh Johnson is the standing man near the centre front, with his two hands held together.

If it is 1914 or thereabouts, and not 1908 then I stand corrected.

I think I found that there was a Palace trip to Prague, from a long list of Palace friendly matches played at the back of one of Nigel Sands' books.

Certainly there is a lot more info on the back of Martins one, so I hope to get to the bottom of it too!!

Will be following this with much interest!

[martino]

Wow the knowledge of the members on this forum know no bounds.

Pete - Another excellent website to add to my bookmarks. Thanks. I will send Jpegs in a few minutes.

Nutfield - I look forward to receiving further details.

[martino]

Dorking wrote:

Just seen this!!!! I have the same exact same postcard (not the same writing on the back). I always thought it was probably from the Crystal Palace tour to Prague in May 1908???? My one was one of many items that belonged to Crystal Palace goalkeeper Josh Johnson. Quite a collection of his stuff (mostly postcards but also an ancient ticket for his testimonial, a yearbook and some photos of him) surfaced about 10 years ago. My one has 'Prague' written on the back. by Johnson, so I assumed it was the Palace tour there which I thought was 1908. I did an attempt at a translation, and the wording on the stand means "To numbered seats from 15 - 40 and "To in-numbered seats 5 best bank (tier) "Billets" = tickets Originally 90% or more of the collection was hoovered up by a Palace collector Ron Daughtry, and there was an article (or two?) about it in Palace Echo showing off some of the best bits, however he sold it off piece by piece about 5 or so years ago, and I got quite a lot of decent stuff from it. I have a second postcard from the same tour - the other one is also with a stand in the background but with everyone in kits. It also says 'Prague' (written by Johnson) on the back. In the pic above I believe Josh Johnson is the standing man near the centre front, with his two hands held together. If it is 1914 or thereabouts, and not 1908 then I stand corrected. I think I found that there was a Palace trip to Prague, from a long list of Palace friendly matches played at the back of one of Nigel Sands' books. Certainly there is a lot more info on the back of Martins one, so I hope to get to the bottom of it too!! Will be following this with much interest!

Thanks for the post and the translation; I thought it was a hotel in the background!

The message on the back starts "Hotel ??????, Christiania" which points to Norway. The rest of the message on my postcard is the usual stuff about the scenery etc. Just as well he mentioned the matches in Copenhagen.

[nutfield priory]

Hi Martin

Can now confirm the following information on the postcard I have from my records.

The photo is believed to have been taken outside the Copenhagen Idraets Stadium as the wording is in Danish and refers to seat numbers (15-40) etc. Palace played two games in Denmark, both against a Copenhagen Select XI

The last two games Palace played were in Norway, both against Christians which were won easily 6-1 and 4-1.

Years ago I thought the same as Dorking that it was from the tour of Bohemia in 1908 until I was corrected by a Swedish collector who recognised the Idreats Stadium.

[martino]

nutfield priory wrote:

Hi Martin Can now confirm the following information on the postcard I have from my records. The photo is believed to have been taken outside the Copenhagen Idraets Stadium as the wording is in Danish and refers to seat numbers (15-40) etc. Palace played two games in Denmark, both against a Copenhagen Select XI The last two games Palace played were in Norway, both against Christians which were won easily 6-1 and 4-1. Years ago I thought the same as Dorking that it was from the tour of Bohemia in 1908 until I was corrected by a Swedish collector who recognised the Idreats Stadium.

Excellent. Thanks for the information. From my postcard I can confirm that Palace won their two matches in Copenhagen "easily"!

Thanks to everyone for their interest and help.

[Dorking]

nutfield priory wrote:

Hi Martin Can now confirm the following information on the postcard I have from my records. The photo is believed to have been taken outside the Copenhagen Idraets Stadium as the wording is in Danish and refers to seat numbers (15-40) etc. Palace played two games in Denmark, both against a Copenhagen Select XI The last two games Palace played were in Norway, both against Christians which were won easily 6-1 and 4-1. Years ago I thought the same as Dorking that it was from the tour of Bohemia in 1908 until I was corrected by a Swedish collector who recognised the Idreats Stadium.

That is fantastically useful.

I can only assume therefore that the Palace player Johnson (who unhelpfully for this case was at Palace from 1907 to 1915!!) who collected postcards, incorrectly annotated the photo many years after the tour and mistakenly annotated it as Prague (ie 1908) when actually it was the Copenhagen trip !

Fab stuff, as apart from Johnson, I'd only ever bothered to recognise Edmund Goodman.

[Dorking]

The ground in question






Certainly lots of arches in evidence!

That they then went on to Norway is good enough for me.

[Dorking]

With a bit of time and effort, some of the other players in the picture might be recognisable and could be cross referenced as being 1914 squad

[Pete’s Picture Palace]

All brilliant stuff from my fellow Palace collectors.

If it helps, I have a team group postcard from 1912/3 which I show here as there are a few faces there who were in Copenhagen.



Dorking, if you'd like to have that in your inbox, I'll do that happily.

[Dorking]

I've got the same original photo/card already thanks Pete. It's having the time and patience to try and find a distinctive face or two and match them up.

This thread certainly proves Leslie's point that 'where there's one there's two' !!!

Crazy really, because I have the complete set of 15 cig cards by Taddy and Co from 1913, which cost a small fortune to do over the space of 20 years, but without a name list I'm rubbish at identifying these players!

Strangely I recognise quite a lot of the earlier players at Palace (1907-08 vintage) as their images are very well known and reproduced due to their cup exploits

[yachtsmun]

martino wrote:

The message on the back starts "Hotel ??????, Christiania" which points to Norway. The rest of the message on my postcard is the usual stuff about the scenery etc. Just as well he mentioned the matches in Copenhagen.

Christiana is a suburb of Copenhagen - a self-proclaimed "autonomous neighborhood" that operates under its own rules slightly outside of regular Danish law and convention re. property ownership, sale of cannabis etc. An interesting neck of the woods if you're ever over that way. I suspect a few Leicester fans will be seeking it out over the coming weeks - if anyone on here makes a visit, don't get caught taking photos around Christiana, the locals really don't like it...
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Always looking for pre-1980 Cowes homes, pre-1987 Cowes aways, and any other bits and bobs relating to Cowes F.C. and I.W. football in general. Someone has to.

[martino]

yachtsmun wrote:

martino wrote: The message on the back starts "Hotel ??????, Christiania" which points to Norway. The rest of the message on my postcard is the usual stuff about the scenery etc. Just as well he mentioned the matches in Copenhagen. Christiana is a suburb of Copenhagen - a self-proclaimed "autonomous neighborhood" that operates under its own rules slightly outside of regular Danish law and convention re. property ownership, sale of cannabis etc. An interesting neck of the woods if you're ever over that way. I suspect a few Leicester fans will be seeking it out over the coming weeks - if anyone on here makes a visit, don't get caught taking photos around Christiana, the locals really don't like it...

Very confusing. Just to clarify, on my postcard the author starts "Hotel ??????, Christiania" so he may have written the card in Copenhagen. The postmark is Kristiania with a Norweigan stamp affixed.

Following extract is from Wiki:

Oslo (English pronunciation: /ˈɒzloʊ/, OZ-loh,[8] Norwegian pronunciation: [ˈuʂˈlu]  ( listen) or, rarer [ˈusˈlu] or [ˈuʂlu]) is the capital and the most populous city in Norway.

Oslo constitutes both a county and a municipality. Founded in the year 1040, and established as a "kaupstad" or trading place in 1048 by King Harald III, the city was elevated to a bishopric in 1070 and a capital under Haakon V around 1300. Personal unions with Denmark from 1397 to 1523 and again from 1536 to 1814 and with Sweden from 1814 to 1905 reduced its influence. After being destroyed by a fire in 1624, the city was moved closer to Akershus Fortress during the reign of King Christian IV and renamed Christiania in his honour. It was established as a municipality (formannskapsdistrikt) on 1 January 1838. Following a spelling reform, it was known as Kristiania from 1877 to 1925, at which time its original Norwegian name was restored.

[Tynie Topics]

There is still a Hotel Christiana in Oslo, built in 1917

http://christianiateater.com/
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https://www.flickr.com/photos/footballprogrammes/albums

[littlewiggy]

Nothing to add from me I'm afraid, just wanted to say what a fascinating thread.

Loved the pics and all your narratives, especially the modern day pics of what that lovely arched entrance looks like today.

Threads like these are the reason I find this forum so addictive.